£500 for engine??

[dajwid]

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FIAT-500-ENGINE-500-CC-ORIGINAL-499CC-USED-/260808199506?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3cb9614d52#ht_500wt_1156

£500 starting bid for a 500cc engine with carb and bits missing. says she has fitted a 126 engine to her 500 now.

I assume she was told it was worth a fortune.

Mmmmm, maybe as most 500s are using 126 engines I suppose these may be worth a bit in the future.

[Bar Vitelli]

What's a fair price for a broken Fiat 126 gearbox (accidentally went into reverse instead of 4th gear when doing about 30 mph) and 123 Electronic Ignition?

[Darrell]

Without a carb fitted and sitting out in the open...

123 ignition I'll shut-up about.

[124cso]

Then don't bid SIMPLE.

Probably wants to recoup cost of 650 motor. There are people like that and if you try and suggest it's too dear, then expect a torrent of abuse. That is also typical of that sort of people.
Been there, done that !

[Rusty's Uncle]

"But you Don't Know what you've got till it's gone"
Joni Mitchel I believe.
So it is a funny old world as Fiat 500 owners, trike and buggy builders  have sacrificed many 126s in order to transplant the running gear as an upgrade etc & in addition as the 126 was petty much the cheapest set of wheels on the street they became throw away items when they were no longer required. So we have ended up with a situation where the 126 right hand drive has become an endagered species and much sought after.
The other side of the coin is that loads of the 479ccs, 499ccs & 594ccs have been scrapped and have become rarer items. So those people who want originality , either because they want to experience the drive as it was meant to be or because they want to enter into classic events where originality is a requirement, are findig it harder to source parts.
At that price I would want to know a lot more about that engine and I think it will struggle to sell but if it is a decent low mileage motor and you add up the value of the component parts then the price may not be too far off.
I have got a 25 year old price list from Middle Barton Garage and their top spec engine was priced at £2,800 

[Darrell]

Something else for the tuning nutters out there is a thought I have had.

The 500 engine had a shorter stroke is that correct?

If so I wonder if it would be easier on the crank when higher revs are wanted?

[Rusty's Uncle]

Same stroke Darrell , in fact some of the "hotter" engines actualy have a longer stroke.

[Darrell]

I thought it was shorter on the 500?

I saw somewhere the piston size was the same for 650 and 500?

Must look that up...

[damon500]

No definitely the same stroke between 500 and 126 Aircooled- from memory 499cc 500 is 67.4mm and 126 650 is 77mm I think... correct me if i'm wrong as it has been a while since I rebuilt one!

[Darrell]

Thanks for clarifying that, been a while since I scratched my head about specs of engines too.

So basically you could make a 126 engine from a 500 engine by just putting-in bigger pistons yes?

[damon500]

Yes, if you fit 650cc pistons and barrels to a 500 engine (after boring the crankcase) you can enlarge it to 650cc- which is precisely what i am planning to do with my 500 Giardiniera engine.
One of my 500's has 650 pistons and barrels fitted on the 500 Crankcase- only thing to remember is that you need spacers under the barrels to correct the increased compression..

[Darrell]

So confirm the crankcase and crankshaft are exactly the same?

Because if this is the case, 500 engines must surely be something to hold on to.

[Rusty's Uncle]

The cranks are all interchangeable . As you should know Darrell the crankcases are different in that the 500 & 126 starter motors are different but that is only a minor problem. Again from memory you can fit the spacer rings or a spacer plate that has the effect of reinforcing the bored out crankcase. I believe that the reinforcing is a very good idea especially if you are thinking about a tuned engine.
So you can have a 500 engine that to all intents & purposes looks bog standard , run a 28IMB car on a "naughty" head, 652ccs barrels and cam and the 500 bell housing on a 126 gearbox. You would still get past scrutineering or be OK for concours but have a very tidy nippy motor 

[Darrell]

I think that would be the most desireable way to go for a 500 and will have a go at doing precisely that with my 500.

I got a 600 engine too now so I guess that would also have the same stroke.

I was going to take the head off of the 600 engine to see if it was ok as my 126 is a bit sick right now.

You know...how is a guy meant to remember all the stuff I need to at work, and all the stuff about the fiats and the anniversary!

Luckily we have the forum

[Alfons1972]

I think that would be the most desireable way to go for a 500 and will have a go at doing precisely that with my 500.

Hi Darrell, then you should look here: http://www.fi500.de/detail.php?id=2929

besides: did you know, there are lightened piston pins? They are about 20g lighter than standard pins: http://www.fi500.de/detail.php?id=2087
as I read, they are included in the tuning-kit mentioned above...

or look here: http://www.500mania.it/ns/index.php/store_gbr/prodotti/engine/engine-parts/plate-to-reinforce-fiat-500-f-l-cylinder-block.html

I am building a 600ccm-engine, too. Based on a 500d-crankcase I am willing to build an engine with the Abarth 595 SS specifications...