Club126UK
Fiat 126 Chat => Fiat 126 Mechanical Problem Solving => Topic started by: Bar Vitelli on October 11, 2013, 09:11:47 PM
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So, I got my red car through it's MoT with bit of welding and some mechanicals and it is very fast in the top gears, but there are some problems. In first gear it makes a whining noise if let the clutch out completely. If I let it out only partially it drives okay and moves forward. Does that mean that the clutch is set too high and how big a deal is that to fix? The other problem is it keeps cutting out, maybe through overheating? How do I check and how tricky is it to fix? Any advice very welcome. The car has done less than 2,000 miles in the last 6 years....
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is that bolt that I showed you in the cooling casing for the thermostat still an issue? I cam p[op down tomorrow if you're free and bring the rear glass too?
The thermostat could be an overheating issue
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Thanks, Chris, that would be great, I'm keen to get it sorted for Red Oktober, I'll have those lights ready for you if you do pop down! ;D
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When does it cut out? What are you doing when it cuts out? Is it when you come off power and put the clutch in or is it when on power or both? Did you do the fuel filters and check the fuel lines?
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If it's cutting out under power it's gotta be an ignition fault surely?
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Or fuel starvation.
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We took it for a drive and Chris thinks the thermostat is okay, it drove great for a while and then cut out (I was worried it wouldn't!) and after 5 minutes got it started again. It was as I was slowing down it cut out but slowly and it stopped it if I pulled the choke up. We were stuck for a whole but think it could be as simple as the fan belt is set too tight so when it stops raining I'm going to have a crack at changing it unless anyone has any other ideas? The whining noise in 1st gear is probably the clutch so I'll have to decide whether to risk it to Red Oktober or just take my green car... :(
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Keeping it running by pulling the choke up normally means it is running lean, could be carb set up, dirty carb, blocked fuel filter, perished or collapsed fuel lines, or a leaky gasket at the base of the carb, or a few other things. Spray some carb cleaner around the base of the carb to see if you can see any bubbles, remove the jets and blow them through with compressed air (one at a time so you don't have to remember what way round they go in) check filter and pipes. Not necessarily in that order.
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Thanks, Marc, I'll see if I can get someone to help me with that next week. Would that mean that it is not overheating? And why does it start back up again after 5 minutes or so?
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Might be worth checking the pump as well. It would have to be getting to potentially engine damaging temperatures to vaporize all of the petrol that quickly. My fuel pump was doing the problem you have, it was also drawing petrol through the return for some reason. If it is heat related it could also be the coil on it's way out, try swapping it for one off of one of your other cars.
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Rust particles in the fuel tank?
My 126 drove me crazy with the cutting out and I pretty much tried/changed/serviced everything on the ignition and fuel system and it still did it and seemed to be getting worse in terms of how far I could go before it happened. Like you after some minutes the car would start. Not a sign of muck in the fuel filter etc but thought it could be rust in the tank. There is a fine gauze filter on the pick up tube inside the tank so as you drove the particles would eventualy clog the gauze so no fuel gets through. To test my theory I started the car and just let it run for about 20 mins. The engine kept running ok as the fuel was not sloshing about. I then drove around my little block which you would measure in hundreds of yards accelerating hard in 2nd gear then braking hard. Idea was to thoroughly agitate the petrol in the tank. I managed to get the engine to die after about 400 yards. When I got the tank out and flushed out the rust there was litteraly only about a level teaspoon full causing all the problems.
Might not be the answer but easy to test ;D
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Thanks, Rusty, I'll add it to my checklist, I'm looking tight for Red Oktober in my red car unless I take a risk, looks like I'll be doubling up with the missus in the green car...
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I'm with Rusty on this one. rusty fuel tanks in the 126 cause all sorts of problems, and it can be a bugger to fault find until you have pretty much done everything else.
I would advise anyone buying a 126 to replace the fuel tank with a new one as a matter of course. I will be putting a new one on my 1974 car, when it comes back.
Gary try a new tank and lines, check the pump and clean the carb and I reckon it'll be fine :-)
Tom
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Fuel tank debris. It amazes me how much crud is in fuel and the tanks it is stored in. It also amazes me how many cars out there have the filter at the furthest end of the fuel line, (talking about the 500, not sure of the 126`s) , in the engine bay of all places, where theres a capsule of fuel being heated up.
If the filter is put as close to the outlet hose as possible, ie next to the tank, that will avoid any debris resting in the fuel line, before reaching the pump, clogging up the fuel delivery.
Having had a new fuel filter just by the tank, (on my 500), and knowing my tank is a very clean one, it can be said that the quality of fuel beneath the garage forecourts ar less than clean, that after a year my filter has plenty of debris in it .
That is of course your cutting out is due to fuel. Hope you find the problem. Mike.
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There is no real option on a 126, the tank is under the rear seat so the filter is by default in the engine bay. Crud on the internal tank filter does take a few minutes to fall off after turning the car off, my Scirocco did that, I put a lawnmower fuel filter of the end of it, sorted the problem as they are long and cylindrical so the flakes do not sit tight on them, but a 126 tank is cheap and easy to change as long as you prepared for a bit of swearing and scuffed knuckles.
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Thanks, Mike, I've got a good list of things to eliminate so will have a crack next week with the hep of my mechanic friend...if I can fix the cutting out thing I'll probably risk it on the 80 mile round trip to Red Oktober even with the clutch issue. :)
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You are not wrong there Mike !
Fuel filters in the aircooled engine bay have caused a few disasters I am sure. I came soooooooooo close it was scarey :o
When the fan let go in my 500 at high revs it happened in a micro-second and I did not know what had happened but sensed that something was wrong so I turned back towards home , about 3 miles. The The engine power dropped off and almost made it home but the last hill was too much with little power so pulled over. Opening the engine lid the heat was intense and the plastic fuel filter between the pump & carb was now round about the size of an tennis ball and I could see the hot petrol inside bubbling. I touched it with my finger and the filter shell now had the consistency of a soft ball , almost balloon. It scared the hell out of me. I now have no extra filter on my 500 and have a metal and glass filter well away from the engine on my 126 :)
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Just braved another 20 mile toot in it and think it must be allergic to traffic lights and junctions because that's where it always cuts out. Other than that it drives like a dream and packs a real speed punch! It seems to have a bigger petrol tank in that it took £24 to fill it up rather than the £18 or so my other cars take? Anyway, the fuel link does seem to be the key whether it's a dirty carb or a rusty petrol tank so the plan is to try get it back in the garage next week before Red Oktober. Thanks for all the tips fingers crossed I'll get it sorted. :)
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When I was in the car it sounded like a fuel starvation thing but it also could be a number of things.. New fueltanks are £40 though
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If it's only cutting out when hot, you should check the condenser on the distributor, and also check the valve clearances. These two is likely to cause sudden cut-outs when the engine reaches normal operating temperature.
The condenser is a really cheap goodie, and it definitely worth to keep a spare one in the trunk when you're on the go.
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Mine did the same thing. Drive for about 10 miles or less and stop. Get out to check and 5 minutes later it goes. Turned out to be an old set of suppressed plug leads that where breaking down when they got hot.
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Well, my mechanic chappy has been too busy to take a look at my car although he may come free next week. I'm pretty sure it's not a overheating problem as I've just done a 160 mile round trip in it today. The problem seems to occur in 1st or 2nd gear only, typically when I am slowing down or sometimes when I put my foot on the accelerator after slowing down. The workaround I've used is to pull the choke out when in 1st or 2nd gear and this does work but I'd love to understand what's wrong especially if this would mean I could fix it myself rather than continue to wait for my mechanic to come free as he is very busy right now...
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Seems that you have part answered your own question there. If pulling the choke on gets you over the problem then it has to be fuel. So the usual suspects :o
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If it runs alright on choke, then the problem is probably somewhere around the main jet. Take the float chamber cover off the carb, unscrew the main jet from the bottom of the float chamber, and if there's something blocking it, try to blow it out with compressed air.
It also worth to soak the whole carb in a bucket of gasoline or ethanol to disperse all the goo deposits.
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I have had the same problem, the float inside the carb was leaky.
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But that would have the opposite effect and make it over fuel.
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I think it's sorted...
I've not actually fixed it but took it on a 160 mile trip with the choke out on low revs and it's now working a treat. I think thee must have been something blocking the carb thing that's hopefully been blown out. Just shows, our cars like to be driven! ;D
Just need to fix the grinding noise when I'm in 1st gear now and it will be perfect! ;D
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I have had the same issue as where the engine cut out when you stop quickely and sometimes on idle when the chock is off. Ifound the idle mixture screw screws in with the vibrations of the engine. the cure is of course to unscrew the screw about 2-3 turns. i it happens again you might find the spring or cap is not holding the screw and stopping it from turning, what I id (I know it sounds crazy) is put a small amout of rtv sillicone sealer on the threads of the screw and then set up the mixture and then leave it to set. I have never had a problem since.
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i have been having a mare with mine cutting out mechanic changed coil, condenser , fuel pump, and cleaned carb and gave it a bit of a tune , running well so far 8)