Club126UK
Fiat 126 Chat => Fiat 126 Mechanical Problem Solving => Topic started by: Blonde126 on January 21, 2012, 03:39:24 PM
-
I was driving in the dark not too long ago on an unlit dual carriageway which had windy roads and was horrified by how little I could see! I was dropping down to 40mph because the visibility was so poor. Even on the lit roads in urban areas I was struggling to see far ahead (and it's not my eyesight!)
I was wondering if there was an easy way to make the head lights brighter, such as a different bulb? If not I'd be willing to do something more complicated to make driving safer :-
Thanks!
-
lucas llb416, bulbs are a bit better, and fit straight in, but seem to be hard to find. I have heard of a halogen replacement, but I don't yet know what it is. Will let you know when I suss it out.
Marc
-
Hi! It's funny that the guys fitted on Bis relay for the horn... but they forgot about the lights. In EL/ELX models, because of the H4 bulbs, there is only one relay to unload the main switch of the lights (unsatisfactory also disappointing with the 1 mm2 wiring).
The only way to go is installing relays and thicker wires to avoid the voltage drop and to unload the switches. Read this: http://www.danielsternlighting.com/tech/relays/relays.html The only thing I subjectively don't like is the fuse before the relay. Usually there are 2 fuses after the relay each light (left and right). With one fuse you can badly loose your lights together. Also if they produce cars without a fuse between the battery and the relay, it's OK.
If you wanna make the optimal transformation, you'll need 2 relays, 4 mm2 wire battery-relays, 4 mm2 relay- 2 fuses if they are connected) or 2,5 mm2 relay to each fuse, 2,5 mm2 (fuse-bulb), 2,5 mm2 direct negative wire (bulb-battery).
The cables coming from the low-high beam switch go to relay terminal 86.
The easier way is to use the actual wiring fuse-bulb-ground, adding only new cables for the relays.
After all, find H4 reflectors (easy to buy) and fit nice halogen lamps with "more light" for example Osram (http://www.osram.com/osram_com/Consumer/Automotive_Lighting/Products/Headlights/NIGHT_BREAKER_PLUS/index.html).
Do not run halogen lamps with no relays!
Regards! :)
-
Try using halogen bulbs. When I bought my bis the headlight bulbs were 410/HB12/P45 45/40W. I converted to halogen bulbs with 60w/55w wattage. It is a huge improvement. The Bis have inbuilt relays, so no conversions/modifications needed.
-
Could be in certain models, so better make sure if there are relays.
(http://fiat126.hu/image/h/822/11913.jpg)
(http://fiat126.hu/image/h/822/11918.jpg)
(http://www.pf126.ovh.org/elementy/danetechniczne/schematy/7.jpg)
-
:$ Sorry, I didn't know that in the UK were different diagrams, because of dim-dip lights. But there's still not a relay for the high beam and maybe still skinny wires.
(http://fiat126.hu/image/h/822/11917.jpg)
-
Hang on, thread confusion ???.
Has a UK BIS got suitable wiring and relays for halogen bulbs? :cry:
Marc
-
Relays are the only way to go. Use the current fron the column switch/headlight switch as a switching source only and run heavy wiring from your power supply through your relay/s to the headlights. Don't forget to use heavier wiring to earth the headlights as well. My air cooled without relays made the ignition switch so hot you couldn't touch it. Some time ago Lucas used to make a relay that had one main terminal for the main power supply, two inputs for switching and four outlets, two for each headlight beam. I don't know if something similar is still available.
Allan
-
Cheers, but, there seems to be some suggestion above that an UK BIS already has the relays in place, or, I could have got a touch confused.
Marc
-
I have found keeping main beam on in some conditions enables you to see and still the oncoming traffic don't consider it too bright!
-
Well, here comes a little extraction of the UK model diagram. It got relays but only to control the dim-dip device.
So, the conclusion is that the BIS has no the classic relays we are talking about.
You can see in yellow the circuit ignition switch-exterior lights switch-low/high beam column control, then the relay but only to "go around" the dim-dip device and finally to the fuses.
In red you see how the exterior light switch activates the relay.
It means that except the dim-dip device, the diagram is absolutely the same as in the others 126s before BIS. Or in other words "bad lights switchmelting wiring" :P Big shame but it goes the same till the year 2000. :-X (With the little exception that EL/ELX after 1994 got relay to help the exterior lights swithch, but nothing more)...
(http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/3197/fiat126bislightsdiagram.jpg)
-
:(
-
There were loads of threads on this topic and it was concluded that the Bis had the necessary relays. Your diagram is quite interesting. I want to make sure I understand. So the high beam (blue light symbol on the dash) does not have a relay but the normal light does have a relay - is that correct?
-
Still not entirely clear ???, any chance of a yes or no answer in regards of using halogen bulbs in a UK BIS?
Sorry to hassle, but us simple folk need simple clarification.
Marc
-
So the high beam (blue light symbol on the dash) does not have a relay...
Yes!
...but the normal light does have a relay - is that correct?
No!
First of all, lets say what the dim-dip light is. When the ignition switch is ON plus the exterior lights switch is ON (side lights) we have the side lights + low beam powered with voltage less than 12V, because of the ballast resistor. The exterior light switch activates the relay to the right and the ballast resistor gets power from fuse #7 powered by the side light's circuit. The current from the ballast resistor goes trough the left relay when not activated then to fuses #8/9. Low beam shines less than usual.
When you turn the exterior light's switch on on normal low beam, it activates the left relay. In the same time the dim-dip is still working, and the relay connects both lines - the one from the ballast resistor and the other from the L/H beam control. The second one gives (adds) the normal amount of voltage, so we got normal low beam.
The relay to the left is simply a connector.
The power goes the whole way from the ignition switch to the fuses like in the normal 126s.
The idea of the relays is that the switches control them, but the relays are direct bridges from the battery to the bulbs trough the fuses. Then turning the switch on, you actually turn the relay on, not the bulb.
Without the relay the bulbs that are big consumer get power trough 3 switches. The current heats them and one day they fail melting. The relay is small consumer, so those 3 switches can die only because of mechanical problems. The relay can carry the big current bulbs need, and if there are nice fat enough wires, there's no voltage drop - lights work on 100%.
That's all, folks! :)
-
:-X
-
Okay. I have been using halogens for almost three years now. Before purchasing the halogen bulbs, I remember asking the Halfords chap to double check whether the car had the appropriate relays. He said after inspection, that the car had the relays already installed which is located next to the fuse box. This seemed to coincide with what was was discussed in the forum previously (finding the relevant thread is proving impossible). To be safe, I''ll get an electrician to check and look into installing relays for the headlights. I'll keep you posted.
-
Nice one, this seems almost as confusing as the thermostat thing.
Marc
-
A simple test, get someone to flash the main beams or switch between dim and bright.
Whilst this person is doing this, put your head in under the bonnet and listen in the relay cluster. If there is clicking, there is a relay ::)
Careful, if there is no relay you will burn-out the light switch and will then be looking for a big enough socket to remove the steering wheel :o
-
Careful, if there is no relay you will burn-out the light switch and will then be looking for a big enough socket to remove the steering wheel :o
I think it's a 24mm :D
The only problem I had with the original setup was that if everything was turned on (headlights, turn signals, wipers, brake lights) then usually the turn signals would stop flashing, the wipers hardly did their job and the headlights pulsated a bit (plus mine has the old generator as well so no charging on idle). Realys are a good idea for the reasons mentioned (nice drawing Deyan :) ). I also used non halogen bulbs but they were 75/75W instead of the original 45/55W (I think those were the originals).
Made a huge difference in winter driving.
-
Thanks everyone for the replies, I'll give the halogens a try once I get a hold of some spare cash :D
-
I spoke to my local Alfa Romeo garage re relays this morning. The first thing they did to test whether there was a relay, was, they did exacly what Darell suggested. The good news is, there was a clicking sound!!! I could hear the clicking sound from inside the car. The mechanic owned up, that he was not an electrician but was pretty sure it had one.
-
Well, I don´t want to disappoint you but it´s 100% normal to click, cos there is a relay but it´s not the power relay. It´s just a gadget that gives to a 9-10V's (I suppose) line the normal amount of 13,5+ V. That's all. When changing side lights & dim-dip lights to side lights & low beam it do clicks. It do gives a sign like if there is the relay we are talking about. It will click also when you turn the side lights on when ignition contact is on (the right relay on the drawing of the previous page).
You can not trust that guy, cos he sees 126 for first time maybe. And it's normal. I know about a guy in a town 20km from mine, he is a 126 wizard. Listens 3 sec. and says the diagnosis. Separates all the noises in the engine just like that. But about 20 years of experience (before 1989) with mainly 126 and 10 trainings in the factory in Bielsko-biala... Super machinist but 99% not familiar with Alfa for example.
If you don't trust you eyes and the original diagram, go to an electrician and show it to him. But with the clicking test it won't work. With the same test I "discovered" that there is a relay in the ELX of a friend of mine, but why only one!? Then I saw the diagram and it's all clear. There is a relay but only for the main exterior lights switch, not one for low and other for high beam. Better than in the Bis but still a poo...
Here you got the Bis diagram with the dim-dip device:
(http://img39.imageshack.us/img39/1604/bisdiagramwithdimdipdev.jpg)
Now the normal diagram with the power relay:
(http://img864.imageshack.us/img864/1205/normaldiagramwithpowerr.jpg)
It makes a big difference!
Sorry for being that tenacious! :$
Kind regards!
PS:
nice drawing Deyan :)
Thanks! People call me also Picasso ;D :P
-
Many, many thanks. Very informative. You may be correct. I still kept the car booking as I still want a proper electrician to check it. Better safe than sorry. Yes, the mechanic was a bit unfamiliar with 126s but an absolute wizard on Alfas/Lancias. They have dealt with a few odd times vintage 500s. The garage maintains my Alfa.
Would it be possible for you to draw a schematic diagram showing where the new relay should be installed please. Just want to make sure that the electrician knows what he is doing.
-
Would it make sense to move the fuse from your drawing to the side closer to the batt?