Club126UK
Fiat 126 Chat => Fiat 126 Mechanical Problem Solving => Topic started by: ciaoflyer on November 20, 2011, 10:37:29 AM
-
OK
fitted new Plugs, Points, Condenser, Coil and checked distributor and any problems with the linkage being fouled by the plug lead but that all is fine!
As you can imagine a new coil was expensive and I am annoyed to find out that the old one was OK.
So what else could be wrong? It runs sweet until you accelerate take your foot off and then it stalls!
Please help!
-
Assuming this is an aircooled:-
Have you tried the plastic plate 'insulation plate' under the carb? If this has a crack or leaks it can cause the problem?
Have you tried putting the old plugs back in (OK I know you re not an idiot, but that is what caused the same problem with mine, a faulty new plug).
Condenser, again?
Have you got a really strong clean spark?
Carb, jet blocked?
If not I would go for the fuel pump. That is the normal problem
-
Sorry I forgot to mention it is a bis
-
Presume it idles fine. All the things that you have replaced should generally cure it. What about the air and fuel filters? Carburetor? Fuel pump?
-
New air filter, never had a fuel filter :oops:, I am gonna clean carb and check fuel pump next!
p.s revs lovely with the new coil!
-
My coil is still the original one - I think. At least there is no evidence in the car's documentation that the coil was ever replaced. Mmmmm.
Let us know how you get on.
-
Hello. Is your Bis running okay?
-
Not yet, rebuilding the carb tomorrow with a tune up kit from Webcon!
-
Carburetor rebuilt and all shiny and new looking! Went to fit on Sunday and it rained so has to wait until Friday now but fingers crossed!
-
OK carb fitted and this has not fixed the problem >:( Only 2 things left new plug leads or fuel pump!
-
fuel pump pushrod?
-
What length should the push rod be?
-
What else haven't you changed? Voltage regulator? If all else fails, might be worth considering taking the car to a Fiat specialist like Middle Barton or Proeitti.
-
No data in mm. It needs to measure the pressure.
But before that, try the non-return valves. When you suck through the inlet pipe, and blow through the outlet one (covering the pipe for the return fuel) shouldn't pass any air. If there is a leak, skim the contact surface on wet sandpaper (on something flat, table for example), but only turning, not sliding. On the picture to the left is done. If the "brown thing" is worn out (like the upper left one) just turn it round.
;)
(http://fiat126.hu/image/h/814/11979.jpg)
-
Hey, guys 8) Why no one says that I run a big mistake. :$ I have forgotten that the pump of Bis is a bit different ::) I just opened one that I have opened before and... a little surprise. :o So the upper things I said are only for the aircooled kid. Valves are rubber ones.
-
Do not know what it is called, but there is a component in the vacuum system (the vacuum pipe that exits the carb just behind the choke/accelerator linkages goes to it), that is potentially something to do with it.
I can't think of anything else you haven't listed as checked, what do others think?
Marc
-
have you tried rigging up a gravity feed for the fuel to see if the pump is playing up? when you initially said the car runs fine then stalls when you lift off was this in a moving vehicle or revving the engine in a static position? have you played around with the timing and checked that the points gap is set correctly? its a bit if the engine revs fine and then when put under load (ie. tries to move) then it sounds most likely to be the fuel pump giving up the ghost. let us know the answer to my question and then i can get my thinking head on.
-
have you tried rigging up a gravity feed for the fuel to see if the pump is playing up? when you initially said the car runs fine then stalls when you lift off was this in a moving vehicle or revving the engine in a static position? have you played around with the timing and checked that the points gap is set correctly? its a bit if the engine revs fine and then when put under load (ie. tries to move) then it sounds most likely to be the fuel pump giving up the ghost. let us know the answer to my question and then i can get my thinking head on.
It stalls when moving and when sat on the drive just revving it!
-
thats got to be fuel pump on its way out
-
Can you jury rig an electric fuel pump to positively eliminate or confirm that the pump is the main issue?
-
I have a spare pump so gonna mess around with them and see what happens!
-
Let me know how you get on, I'm also experiencing fuelling problems :(
-
when i bought my car it ran fine for about 5 minutes then started conking out, turned out to be the fuel pump. For some reason it worked ok when cold but not when hot. I guess that you lose some of the rod stroke when the engine is hot because of expansion of the aluminium block, but i'm surprised it made such a difference. anyway, with a new pump on it was fine.
as has been suggested, you can eliminate the question of a weak pump by putting a jerry can of fuel above the engine and running a pipe from that into the fuel pump. because gravity is now helping you even a duff pump should work ok, that is how i got the car home!
-
^^Sounds familiar, mine runs ok when cold, when hot it breaks down. Jerry can idea sounds a bit risky though! :o
-
I think that the worn fuel pump push rod is a bit of a myth as it is made of hardened steel. It will wear but if you remove it and it still has a chamfer on each end then it is probably OK. The bit that does wear the most is the contact face of the actuating arm on the fuel pump and as at best there is only about 2.5mms movement from the cam to actuate the pump a little bit of wear can have a dramatic effect.
-
Could the fuel lines be getting blocked inside the tank? Had that on scirrocco. Flakes of rust were sitting over the end of the pipe, wedged a lawnmower fuel filter on the end of the send pipe in the tank, problem sorted for 80 pence.
Marc
-
I think that the worn fuel pump push rod is a bit of a myth as it is made of hardened steel. It will wear but if you remove it and it still has a chamfer on each end then it is probably OK. The bit that does wear the most is the contact face of the actuating arm on the fuel pump and as at best there is only about 2.5mms movement from the cam to actuate the pump a little bit of wear can have a dramatic effect.
yes, on the worn out pump that whole moving finger arrangement was loose, sloppy, shagged. funnily enough i was 'tidying up' a bit in the garage last night, came across the old pump and flung it in the bin. I never like throwing stuff away, but the problem is years later you are looking at things and trying to remember if its a secondhand spare you havent used yet or something that didnt work but you kept for sentimental reasons!
-
If the car has supressed spark plug leads these could be breaking down when they get hot. Include the coil lead if you are able to change them to see.
-
Ok car is running again ;D New fuel pump works a treat unfortunately it has not cured the original problem it still stalls! >:(
So this all started when I removed the exhaust to repair it with putty and bandage, this aloso involved removing the earth strap, could this be the source of my problems?
-
Also going to check valve clearances, what is the correct gap for the BIS? Also how do you turn the engine by hand?
-
I am not sure it is the earth strap. When I had problems with mine, the car just went completely dead when I turned the ignition. There was no clicking sound, so there was no power going to the solenoid. The earthstrap looked new and was not loose, so did not suspect it. Despite there being no power, I managed to push start the car. I was baffled! Took the car to Proeitti. The culprit was the earthstrap. The contacts just needed cleaning but as a precaution, they installed another earthstrap. So I have two earthstraps! Good thing is, they just charged me for the earthstrap, and that was it.
-
Ok old exhaust off, new one ready to be fitted :) Just been out and bought a new earth strap :)
One last thing also bought an exhaust stud and it came with a slightly squashed/crimped nut, is this so it tightens the stud first and then tightens itself or do I have to replace the nut?
-
You seem to be going though hell & high water with your car , I hope that you finaly get it sorted. That nut you mention could be a philidus nut. They look a bit like a nylock nut but the top is solid but has a slit/slits in the top section which is then distorted a little to give you a very effective self locking nut. I would be inclined to use two normal nuts , locked together , to wind the stud into position then use the special nut when the exhaust is fitted. If you google philidus you can see images of how the nuts look :)
-
Thanks Rusty! The nut looks like this.......dam can't find a photo on google will take a pic of it! Watch this space!
-
Here's the pic.......
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d18/ciaoflyer/DSC_0465.jpg)
-
Well I am not sure now as that looks a bit like a "poor man's" locking nut with the top crimped in with something like a 3 jaw chuck. If it is plated steel then it may be designed as a one time fitting as it will possibly damage the stud thread . If it is solid brass then it will be OK. If in doubt I would go for brass or stainless nuts if you are thinking long term. I prefer stainless but you can get brass M8 x 1.25 exhaust nuts quite cheaply at most motor factors :)
Philidas nuts are a precision engineered item and probably not suitable on the exhaust as they will loose their temper in the steel due to the heat and hence the locking effect will be diminished :$
-
OK all replaced and fitted but not cured :(
New earth strap has not cured the problem. I have checked the rocker gaps and reset. However, when I took off the rocker cover a piece of metal had been broken off the cover where the rocker had hit it, I have removed this and checked that they are not fouling the cover anymore and this seems fine.
The car is still stalling on revving the engine and there is no power when accelerating, I am at a loss of where to go with it next.
-
I am a Tit, look what I have just found on my advance hose....
(http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d18/ciaoflyer/DSC_0468.jpg)
-
You seem to have covered the electrics, engine internals, carb, and fuel pump. Could it be a collapsing fuel line, rust blocking the fuel pick up in the tank, running too lean mixed with cold weather, bad seal between airbox and carb freezing the carb, lose butterflys in venturis, blocked jet, blocked exhaust, advance/retard issue, driving up hill unknowingly?
Just trying to think of easily overlooked things. Hope you suss it soon.
Marc
-
You tit :D
Hope that's the end of your troubles.
-
Seems that you have to expect the unexpected. I heard a new one yesterday talking to a guy who had fitted the accu-spark type electronic ignition. The car ran fine for a while then developed a random ignition problem, misfire etc. After many unsucessful efforts to sort it he decided to revert back to standard ignition . On removing the electronic ignition he noticed something odd about the magnet rotor part of the ignition. At some stage a small washer had fallen into the body of the distributor then in running the magnet had managed to pick this up and was causing the problem.
-
I have also noticed that on the side of the Mag marelli distributor, a rubber plug is missing, it plugs the hole where you adjust the points, can something else be used to plug this hole?
-
:o
The little pebble overturns the cart... :-X
And like a bonus there was leaner mixture ::)
Well the "aircoolers" around have an excuse :$ The last thing we would think about is the vacuum advance ;D OK, maybe the water pump is the last one 8)
Well done!
-
At last!!! Well done!!
-
Regarding the self locking nut, there are nuts that look crimped or have a slightly oval shaped bore when viewed from above. I've found these to be used mainly on suspension components (drop links, stabilisers) but they do work well and they don't damage the thread.
-
Regarding the self locking nut, there are nuts that look crimped or have a slightly oval shaped bore when viewed from above. I've found these to be used mainly on suspension components (drop links, stabilisers) but they do work well and they don't damage the thread.
I reckon it is so you can tighten the exhaust without the need for a lock washer
-
:) :) Great news the car is back on the road after a few months, very pleased! Next time I am going to check the obvious first, this has been a learning curve! However I have some nice shiny new parts:
Coil
HT Leads
clean carb with new overhaul kit
Points and Condenser
Petrol filter
Spark plugs
Second hand stater, (cold killed the other)
Exhaust (The other was falling to bits)
A short piece of hose :$
Runs like a dream after I used a strobe to time her! Even the flat spot has gone on acceleration I think this may of been due to the old rusty exhaust!
I am very happy!
Now 2CVGB magazine has arrived so gonna sit back with a beer and think about the other car in the garage for a change!
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
-
Great news :D
2cv??? There fitted with a 2cylinder aircooled aren't they? horizontal if I remeber right?
Some one told me I could use a rev counter from them but I could never find one.
-
Yep horizontal 2 cylinder air cooled, you could possibly fit a rev counter from one but they never had one fitted only a speedo I am afraid!
-
Went on a 60 mile round trip today to the National Arboretum....never missed a beat! FAB!
-
Good news indeed. Now i know what to look for when i get round to fixing mine, hopefully next month if the weather improves! :)