Club126UK

Fiat 126 Chat => Fiat 126 Mechanical Problem Solving => Topic started by: richard on November 21, 2005, 08:06:09 PM

Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: richard on November 21, 2005, 08:06:09 PM
hello there, i tested the engine today after installing it ??

serveral problems :  it blew fuse number 7 ??

it turned over but was very noisy and sluggish on turn over ?

could it be starter? or if starter was faulty wouldnt it turn??

it didnt really fire ? but not sure if the other problams were stopping that ?

there was power at the alternater even with igition off ( is this normal) and it was sparking (or seemed to be shorting out for some reason) ????? .. i did put copper seal on the thread so the bolt wouldnt seize i future could this have been the trouble ?

the battery isnt too good atall, so cpould this be the reason behind the sluggish turn over ?  still doesnt explain the noise does it ?


has anyone got any ideas atall please?

as honestly if i do not get the little devil going i am afraid my fiance has told me it has to go , and i would rather keep it ..

help please help .......
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: toz on November 21, 2005, 08:37:33 PM
hi.i would reccomend you either charge the battery or but a new one.my fsm seems to chug like a diesel before it starts,i have to give it 1/2 to 3/4 choke otherwise it wont start.my car is not electronic ignition so takes a few turns before it starts,but i hear you can get a kit for them.as the points burn away.i will have a look at mine tommorow(fuse no7).does the starter make a screaming noise before it works??if so you want a new or reconditioned unit.i dont know why you would get power to the alternator without the ignition on.it might be something to do with your ignition switch??????it will drain the battery if there is power to the alternator anyway.which will make the starter slower.hope this helps!!!!!  :???:
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: Chris Lakin on November 21, 2005, 10:10:27 PM
Richard the engine will chug like that if its miss firing / or the timing is out,

check the timing is correct!

did you get anything out of the exhaust?? even a little smoke?

aslo did you get my email richard?

regards

Chris
Title: timing etc etc.
Post by: richard on November 21, 2005, 10:19:20 PM
i havent checked the timing atall, infact im not sure if i could ??

even with reading the manual  :cry:

its a unusual sound it makes when the engine is turning , and i didnt notice anything from the exhaust as i wasnt at that end??

fiance would be happier if it was going, she said i have a couple of weeks or it has to go  :???:


i wanna keep it, so welcome any help, but if your close and know your onions i would love some pratical help
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: Chris Lakin on November 21, 2005, 10:50:19 PM
ther is a good page on the members section on timing, from Chris Lewis

its from an autobooks manual, its easier to understand as its in diagrams.

regards

Chris
Title: fuses ?
Post by: richard on November 22, 2005, 06:29:52 AM
i am more than certain it isnt the timing, as it was a mechanicial grinding kind of sound from near the starter i thought??

furthermore can anybody confirm if all the fuses in a d reg 1986/7 fsm 126 should all be 8 am as haynes suggest??

as my fuse box is full of all sorts of amps ?????
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: fiatfsm on November 22, 2005, 10:38:53 AM
To be honest Richard, you need someone actually with you at the car to diagnose whats wrong, we could all be guessing at whats wrong for ages. Maybe your starter isnt properly engaging with the flywheel, make sure all the starter connections are 100% clean and tight, you could test the starter off the car? Check and double check your points gap, its critical that its spot on or it just wont start. Good luck!
Title: engine in but...
Post by: The Doctor on November 22, 2005, 07:40:55 PM
Hi Richard, good advice from everyone above. All fuses should be 8 amp, according to my owner's handbook, original Polish! My FSM (1990) starts within a second or two of pulling the starter, but I always need 3/4 choke; that noise you have does sound like a bad starter engagement, but as said earlier, you really need someone to be there when it happens. Are you serious about getting rid of your 126? after all, they are harder to come by than a fiancee :smt005
cheers
Graham
Title: update on troubles
Post by: richard on November 22, 2005, 08:24:45 PM
on getting into my car tonight to have another look

i first hooked on the battery and turned the engine and the noise wasnt apparent, although it was quite slow turning

so i decided to drive my mazda close to the 126 and jump it and add more power to battery to see if it turned alot better

however on hooking up the battery earths first, and then a + to the mazda, i then procedded to hook on positive to the 126 ,, when i di this i got a massive spark ????


is a fiat 126 negative earth ??  and should i have hooked on the + 's first and then the negatives??

please advise as i dont wanna blow myself or the 126 up at the minute

and shall i buy all 8 amp fuses for my fiat d reg  126 fsm, or is it not essential ??


if starter still makes noise after its hooked onto a good battery , i will look into it

anyhelp tonight would be great so i have something to aim for tomorrow night


i am quite hopeful as the grainding noise wasnt apparent when i first got in the car so it might just be a duff battery ,,
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: toz on November 22, 2005, 08:42:15 PM
hi,i would buy all 8amp fuses for the box as mine has 8amps in it.i have always been told to jump start a car with the - first,but would always advise that somebody else helps you.i know somebody that had a battery explode on them,it wasnt nice!!!!!why dont you borrow a battery charger,then you could see if the element was good or bad before buying a new one.
Title: battery ?
Post by: richard on November 22, 2005, 10:34:50 PM
have a battery charger , and i can safley say the battery is no good

however is the 126 a negative earth car please?

and does this explain the spark , when i hooked the - on first

then the +

 ?????????????????
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: fiatfsm on November 23, 2005, 11:19:02 AM
it should be a negative earth Richard, check to see where your negative wire from battery goes, if it goes to earth then..... its a -.
Title: Re: battery ?
Post by: ChrisRLewis on November 23, 2005, 11:40:32 AM
Richard

it should be minus (-) to minus (-)
and plus (+) to (+)
just making sure you are connecting the right way on the jump leads?
and yes the Fiat 126 is a negative earth vehicle.

C
 :)

Quote from: "richard"
have a battery charger , and i can safley say the battery is no good

however is the 126 a negative earth car please?

and does this explain the spark , when i hooked the - on first

then the +

 ?????????????????
Title: engine in but????
Post by: The Doctor on November 23, 2005, 05:57:42 PM
Hi Richard
with a flat battery, your starter could make that grinding, sluggish noise!
(a) get a new battery
(b) your car is negative earth, so make sure the wide, braided wire that is bolted close by to the metal of the boot is connected to the - terminal on the battery
(c) when using another battery, always connect the two +'s first, and then the earth of the donor battery to a good earth on your car, (top of the strut for instance); it's better not to connect it direct to the bad battery, as this could kill the good battery.
(d) change all those fuses to 8amp!
(e) Keep the car!!! :lol:
Title: thanks
Post by: richard on November 23, 2005, 10:10:46 PM
hello you lot, and thanks for the info, ive had a few pms, from members giving advice and some good forum advice .

i have decided to do the following :

buy a new battery

get all 8 amp fuses

check fuel pump / carb / replace if needed

try and do timing ????? myself?

i will let yo know how i get on this weekend ..


i live in leicester does anyone know where i can get a bettery from ?

ive rang halfords and they have one at £44 ?? seem dear to me although i havent brought a battery in ages???

rang a local motor factors and they have a 3 year garenteed battery that they call a budget one for £36

what prices have you and do you lot pay and where from please?

all the best

richard
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: Chris Lakin on November 24, 2005, 02:18:54 AM
well i paid 24 for mine, but it was from a warehouse, where they sell to businesses. However i paid £44 in halfords the year before. Can you not borrow one from someone? or use the one from youre 500?

yes that is a good point Toz made, batt could be making the starter make that noise! giving the starter a few light taps with a hammer may help to loosen it, but i dont want u to break it! so see what others say.

You are almost there, it will be one small & trivial thing!! then u will be 126ing!! Being a 500 owner (& 126 owner now) you should know by now the golden rule. if at first you dont succeed try and try again!!!!!  :lol:

regards

Chris
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: The Laird on November 24, 2005, 07:03:28 PM
Hi Richard, Just an observation.  Make sure when you buy the battery it is the correct size (physically) for the battery pan ( often overlooked ) and also it is the compatible charging rate for the alternator ie battery should be 34 Ah. You could push it to say 40 Ah but no higher otherwise the battery will never get to full charge. The Doctor is correct in his advice but the most important thing when you jump start are the leads. They should ideally be 16mm flexible leads with heavy crocodile clips otherwise you will get resistance. The WORST thing you can do is rev the engine of the donor vehicle as this can cause a spike and damage electronics in the casualty vehicle. Trust me I used to manufacture special battery jump packs when I was in business in the UK.  It may cost a couple of pounds more but go for a sealed gel battery they are far more reliable and you won't get acid all over you if you roll it !!

The Laird
Title: engine in but????
Post by: The Doctor on November 24, 2005, 08:05:10 PM
Hi everyone, this club is great for helping each other, so will someone look at my problem and offer advise pleae :?:
Regarding the cost of things, perhaps the UK is overpriced, as batteries for our beloved 126's cost around £10 (original), full original exhaust system £8-10, and silly little things like wheel trims a silly £3 a set in Poland.  Living so close means I can get these within half an hour.
Hoping to come to the UK in Spring in a large vehicle, so could perhaps bring a few rare items - more of that a little later.
Hope you get on the road soon Richard, cheers M8
Graham :smt077
Title: its a runner yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Post by: richard on November 24, 2005, 11:07:39 PM
:lol:   . hello there, well i have a update for you , darkhorse travelled down and met me tonight and helped me on my fiat 126 , and got it running .

i had some small issues , the timing was slighlty out ... the distributer was 180 degrees out .....     and my battery was shot .... which was why my starter was making a funny noise .. he brought a battery with me and lent it me.....  :)

he has advised me to clean or replace the carb, so i am going to do that as this is a job i know how to do as did it on my 500

and he has cheered me up know end as i thought with me replacing the engine i hadnt improved a non runner ...

when infact its a runner and hopefully a sweet one  :wink:

still have to look at lights etc, this could be down to fuses , bulbs . or bad earths ... and also get a small patch welded onto a sill about 6 inch long ,

and when im happy i will take it for a mot and see what happens .

will keep you all posted thank you so so much for everyones help and advice youve been super
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: Chris Lakin on November 25, 2005, 12:05:43 AM
Richard that is super!!!

That was really nice of him to do that!!!

so you have a runner!!! now! Wooo :lol:

regards


Chris
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: fiatfsm on November 25, 2005, 10:01:08 AM
Great news, btw, you arent the first person to have your dissy in wrong by 180 degrees, I remember someone doing a similar thing a few years back and it took them ages tom work out what was wrong.
Title: engine in but ?????
Post by: ChrisRLewis on November 25, 2005, 11:42:56 AM
It should still work 180 degrees out, but you will have to swap the spark plug leads around.

It is best to keep it the way Fiat recommended though to save confusion!
Title: new purchases
Post by: richard on November 25, 2005, 12:52:48 PM
just bought a battery booster pack from ebay for £25.99

brought all 8 amp fuses

brought a spare battery


.. just to say dizzie did still work even though it was about 180 out.....  all i did was take it out the box of bits i got from the guy i had the car off and bolted it in, so did do too bad really

gonna change fuses. carb and have a look at my bulbs etc .

all the best

richard
Title: its for sale
Post by: richard on November 27, 2005, 05:55:24 PM
landlord on private caravan park where is is kept has ordered its eviction within  2 weeks

someone make me a offer .

or i will ebay it next weekend

reguards

richard

 :cry:   i have pictures and videos of it

its now a runner ......   wasnt as you all know when i got it .. since engine transplant it is
Title: where
Post by: nrg19uk on November 27, 2005, 10:51:53 PM
where abouts are you and also how much you looking for?
Title: videos on internet of 126 running
Post by: richard on November 28, 2005, 09:56:45 AM
http://www.jusspress.com/richemon

video of engine running are at link above.




hope it works

reguards

richard