Fiat 126 Chat => Fiat 126 Chat => Topic started by: Gadge on November 04, 2014, 05:18:39 PM

Title: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on November 04, 2014, 05:18:39 PM
I know I get on my soap box when it comes to bike engined 126's and this is why

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-126-/301378450183?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item462b8e3307

This car was driven to its current location where it's engine and box was pulled out in preperation for a bike engine transplant, Only (and to no surprise!  :o) for the project to not materialise further than that and now an engineless 126 is now up for grabs. This cars fate is now probably sealed as who chuff is going to put this car back on the road. I can only hope someone will - or at least use the parts to help keep another on the road but I fear that it'll end up on the scrap heap...... Like so many others :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mrsgoody76 on November 04, 2014, 06:37:34 PM
I'm keeping an eye on that one as a spares car and have plans for the shell when finished.
Sorry if that upsets anyone :$
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on November 04, 2014, 06:43:37 PM
No at least some good might come of it. I'm just hoping that if it doesn't sell the owner may just take it down the scrap yard and be done with it
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dom.kellett on November 04, 2014, 06:48:10 PM
If anyone does fancy buying my engine to slam in it I may consider once I've done mine?!


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on November 05, 2014, 12:21:47 AM
At least the rolling shell looks to be sound and in good cosmetic condition. I once answered an advert for 126 parts  from a guy who wanted the "personal" registration. In fact, it wasn't personal at all, it was some combination that included "K9" and he wanted to transfer it from the 126 to his new car 'for his dog'. But in order to do this, he had (at the time, I don't know if it's different now) to prove to DVLA that the original car was either permanently exported or permanently scrapped. So he took out all the trim and interior - literally, EVERYTHING, hence the advert for spares. And then he cut the shell up into about 5 or 6 sections with an angle grinder. I arrived at his house (in St Asaph) to find a skip in the front drive with all these parts of 126 body shell in it, like some grotesque giant Rubiks cube. It was clear the car had been in fine condition, and it was quite sickening, to see such wanton vandalism all just to get a pathetic novelty registration. There are some sad people out there...

However, remember that as these people scrap perfectly good cars, the rarity of those that are left goes up, and so does their value. I had to scrap my little Giardiniera in 1987 due to moving house, and the car was so rusty it couldn't be moved without it falling apart. Today a Giardiniera in good condition is worth over £10,000. This will come for the 126 in time, too.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: skoda_norman on November 08, 2014, 12:51:03 PM
I am not adverse to modified cars - infact I would say that I generally applaud them - and that includes well turned out engine conversions. Done correctly they can make for some sublime machines. But I have to say it does sadden me when you see another 126 destined for the scrap pile because someone had ideas above and beyond his station.

What a shame.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: skoda_norman on November 08, 2014, 12:51:44 PM
PS: What is a Giardiniera?

I've never heard of one....
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on November 08, 2014, 05:04:12 PM
It's an estate 500 - air cooled Classic version with an engine that lies on its side very much like a BIS
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Scarlettkitten on November 08, 2014, 06:58:30 PM
It is a shame when people don't complete these things and they get scrapped.

I love modified classics me, just no butchered ones.  I've got my FIRE engine coming soon so I'll start my own conversion but rest assured It'll either be good or I won't start it.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dajwid on November 09, 2014, 04:25:56 PM
Sadly people don't realise the amount of work involved but mostly they don't realise that the chance is the car will never be registered for use on UK roads.
Do your homework first.

Its the old story, We all know a 911 engine fits in a beetle. A bike engine fits in a mini. A Subaru engine fits a T25. NO IT DOESNT ! It a huge amount of work and a lot of cash.

Not that I'm ever one to moan. So many people over the years on the site asking about engine swaps, most end up on Ebay or scrapped. Sad very sad.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Scarlettkitten on November 09, 2014, 06:15:57 PM
Couldn't agree more, I'm no stranger to fabrication though and what ever I do will be bolt on / off-able :)

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mrsgoody76 on November 09, 2014, 06:21:35 PM
Sadly people don't realise the amount of work involved but mostly they don't realise that the chance is the car will never be registered for use on UK roads.
Do your homework first.

Its the old story, We all know a 911 engine fits in a beetle. A bike engine fits in a mini. A Subaru engine fits a T25. NO IT DOESNT ! It a huge amount of work and a lot of cash.

Not that I'm ever one to moan. So many people over the years on the site asking about engine swaps, most end up on Ebay or scrapped. Sad very sad.

We own a T25 and my hubby enquired about the cost to fit a scooby engine in it.
He was given quotes of £4500 to £6500 depending on which engine we had put in  :o
Needless to say, we just had the original aircooled engine reconditioned.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on December 09, 2014, 03:25:34 PM
And another one...... This ones been floating on ebay on and off for months. Nearly there mind you but still no one wants it :(

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171575320641
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Scarlettkitten on December 09, 2014, 04:00:02 PM
Shame, I've just put the BIS engine back in mine, missed driving it :D

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dombooth on December 09, 2014, 04:26:40 PM
And another one...... This ones been floating on ebay on and off for months. Nearly there mind you but still no one wants it :(

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171575320641

Localish too!

Dom
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on December 09, 2014, 08:06:51 PM
It still has its wiper motor Dom :D
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dombooth on December 09, 2014, 10:07:22 PM
It still has its wiper motor Dom :D

Probably still works too. :'(

Dom
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 01, 2015, 07:44:14 PM
........ And if you can't squeeze the bike engine in the back, just stick the bike bit in the front DOH  :D

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=121559331889
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on February 01, 2015, 10:47:49 PM
"in need of tlc" ...  :lol:

I should think the rider/driver will be, too, after 5 minutes in that seat !!

"the wiring is dreadful" ...  Really ??  ::)

(confession: pot calling kettle black here - I've had loads of projects that never saw fruition. OTOH I did at least have the good taste to give them a decent private burial rather than flaunt them on fleabay  :D)
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: stuey on February 01, 2015, 11:51:29 PM
i think that people over estimate their skill, and under estimate how much time,money and equipment it takes to restore a car well let alone modify it massively, Ive been working on my car and modifying pretty much all of it for the last few years, I'm a qualified mechanic and have welders jacks, stands, a sandblasting cabinet, compressor and pretty much all of the tools I might need and I'm struggling to get my head around how much I have to do to get my car to the road and it would be as much again if i where to put a bike engine in it- still amazes me how many people think its just " throw it in the boot with a chain drive and that's it with little or no engineering knowledge.

Sometimes being naive can be in your favour but these types of endings to these "failed projects" illustrate time after time how it normally ends- I can recall a guy on retro rides a few years back with a perfectly serviceable fiat 124 that he wanted to make into a pick up- after people told him not to do it and him saying how he was competent to do the job it ended up going to the scrap yard with a hole cut in the back of it- perhaps we should club together and buy one of these unfinished projects and when another misinformed soul pops up on the forum with a tidy 126 he wants to cut up we can just offer to swap and save another perfectly good 126 from the Sh*t heap...
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 02, 2015, 05:29:05 AM
I must admit I may be being a tad harsh on the trike, after all it may have been a right basket case before it became this thing. I too know all about failed projects. My last BIS project had to be abandoned due to spialing costs and a seemingly never ending trail of corrosion beond my skills. It ended up down the scrap heap which to be honest is where it should've gone when I bought it as it was a right state. The plus side was that all the parts were used or sold on to keep others going.

I love thses little cars and I love them for what they are. It pains me to see them being cut up to satisfy someones urge to make a car that's ridiculously fast in the smallest package possible - usually by someone who isn't really passionate about them.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: gammakeith on February 02, 2015, 07:08:49 AM
I love thses little cars and I love them for what they are. It pains me to see them being cut up to satisfy someones urge to make a car that's ridiculously fast in the smallest package possible - usually by someone who isn't really passionate about them.

I agree.  However, if someone came out with a practical turbo or supercharger conversion kit for the Bis engine I might be tempted to the dark side...........

Keith
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 02, 2015, 04:04:39 PM
I love thses little cars and I love them for what they are. It pains me to see them being cut up to satisfy someones urge to make a car that's ridiculously fast in the smallest package possible - usually by someone who isn't really passionate about them.

I agree.  However, if someone came out with a practical turbo or supercharger conversion kit for the Bis engine I might be tempted to the dark side...........

Keith

Absolutely I would too. If it's realistic and can be achieved then I would look into it. I know it's been done before - especially in supercharged form. And don't get me wrong I've seen some awesome bike engined ones on YouTube it's just over here no one seems to carry them though...... And I'm not surprised as the work involved is enormous it's just ashame they get chopped about before the owner realises that the project isn't going to work so it ends up on ebay...... And who wants to buy a half mutilated 126 with half the bits missing :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dibles on February 06, 2015, 03:48:21 PM
Those bike ones look amazing and a whole load of fun but like most on here I love my little car just the way she is. As previously said keeping her that way is a timely, challenging and costly task in itself! I will continue to look in awe and be impressed with the rally conversions on you tube but to be honest I'm more than happy pottering about with my sub 24 ish HP as I hope to make it to my destination! Lol that reminds me I got to finish working on it first! Hopefully no more sheering nuts off!!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 13, 2015, 09:45:05 PM
And another.......

http://www.gumtree.com/p/other-car-parts-accessories/fiat-126-project/1099337388
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on March 09, 2015, 07:02:11 AM
Annnnnd another...... Mind you this ones well rotten and at least he didn't get halfway through stripping it before he realised he couldn't finish it

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=321690628073
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on June 19, 2015, 09:22:46 PM
It's been a while but here's an EL that's been hacked in to .... Nearly there but not quite
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/141697430307
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dom.kelltt on June 19, 2015, 11:06:03 PM
If the latest one was closer I'd be tempted to buy it for the roll cage and then sort rust/rot on the shell and sell the shell but nearly 4 hours is quite a journey and would cost more in petrol to just buy/ get a roll cage made lol


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on June 19, 2015, 11:48:06 PM
Ive never quite got this "buy a 126 and bike engine it" thing, yes i bet it would be quick and great fun but a few seem to do it and never finish, and even if they do, making it road legal is not easy.

We bought ours for what it is and enjoy it for what it is and always get reactions, conversations and things with people wherever we go in it.

And i'm not having a go at anyone trying to fit any (bike or car) engine into your 126, that's your choice, if that's what you want  to do then do it and post the result's in the forum so we can have a look and sell me the spares from the old engine lol    :D
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dom.kelltt on June 20, 2015, 10:04:39 PM
Yeah I was thinking of a bike engined one but the subaru one was loads cheaper and will be easier to do.

I'm pleased people finally can agree with other people's own choices to do a conversion, but not be bothered to do it themselves.

I am keeping my original engine so I can therefor rebuild the car straight back to standard if the conversion is never possible for me.

Dom


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dadandlad on June 20, 2015, 10:51:05 PM
Dom you can have my shell when I have stripped what I need if you want it doesn't have a cage in it though, but it is only in Halifax

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dom.kelltt on June 20, 2015, 11:21:40 PM
Ahh, Thankyou for the offer but I'd of only been looking for the roll cage out of the one above, thankfully on my shell there is very little rust/rot and it only seems to be surface so far so all is good in that department,

Thank you for the offer though! I'm sure someone on here will snap up the chance for a spare one lol,

Dom


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on June 23, 2015, 08:30:26 AM
I'm pleased people finally can agree with other people's own choices to do a conversion, but not be bothered to do it themselves.


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I don't think people are quite there yet :P while i appreciate that its not my car nor is it my place to tell anyone what to do with it, I've know a few people who are uncomfortable with engine conversions as usually (but not always) the project fails as people get too ambitious and ultimately it ends up getting scraped. That's why I started this thread to highlight just how many are being sold because the owner can't commit to finishing it off due to time and money.  

Engine conversions don't scare me its just a lot of people such as myself haven't found a viable engine and gearbox that can fit in the back of a BIS so haven't seen it as an option. Personally a turbo Subaru engine is a no no due to finding a viable gearbox but I guess we'll all see :P
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dom.kelltt on June 23, 2015, 09:59:46 AM
I totally understand what you mean as my parents say the exact same to me, but I never learn lol, I've stripped the engine now I'm on the rebuild once I've fitted bottom end bearings and also I may be going for a Porsche 944 gearbox as it can handle the power. It's got the correct ratios and also it should fit, once I've got it all measured I can be more accurate :)

Dom


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on June 23, 2015, 05:56:42 PM
The gearbox will be the hardest part of your project. That's where most of your modifying will take place as you'll possibly have to cut and remake the suspension. You do know that the Porsche 944 gearbox is made for a front engined car dont you?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Dom.kelltt on June 25, 2015, 01:20:01 AM
Yes but there is a gearbox conversion company in my local area that offers conversion kits to change it to the rear,

I also know a company making the suspension for me, he's an old mate so doing it cheaper but he sure does a great job

Dom


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 30, 2015, 03:48:13 PM
Here's another one. :( The old "was going to shove a bike engine in it" excuse..... Looks great with the fat tyres though but sadly it'll probably never get finished :(

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=181816960143&globalID=EBAY-GB
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Darrell on July 30, 2015, 03:57:20 PM
pity he didnt keep all the bits :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on July 30, 2015, 10:06:11 PM
Ive just found this one and was going to post it to gadge, bit sad that so many get butchered  and then left  :cry:
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 31, 2015, 05:59:15 AM
Indeed :( obviously we don't know the real reason why it wasn't completed as it looks like some hard work went into that roll cage but i can't help but think that either the owner got bored or he realised the work involved was more complicated that originally planned so threw the towel in.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on October 01, 2015, 10:28:15 PM
One more............ "no time to finish"  >:(

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=311443349842&globalID=EBAY-GB
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: phreak97 on October 02, 2015, 05:06:18 AM
One here in aus got scrapped a few years ago after it was stripped to get a bike engine then got too hard.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on October 02, 2015, 06:14:01 AM
Yep! People don't realise how much work is involved chasing that bike engined dream  :cry:
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on October 02, 2015, 11:41:58 AM
very little fiat left of that one !!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on October 03, 2015, 04:50:15 PM
Another one for sale on "facebook motors north wales", he wants £1500 for it but needs finishing
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: DeVilleChris on October 03, 2015, 05:12:34 PM
Such a shame
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on October 04, 2015, 10:40:39 AM
Yep! Total shame and a waste. As is the problem with bike engined BIS projects because these "engineers" don't plan before they cut they soon realise that even a bike engine is big - just look how tall it is - and with a totally different drive set up (chain) the engine sits so far back that he's had to cut the rear strengthening beam making it unlikely to ever be put back on the road  >:( and now typically he's got no time to finish it.

This is a great example of people's craving for a fast bike engine in a small car. Then realising it's never going to work well as its a bigger task than first anticipated it get pasted on. Some engineer eh DOH!. A bit of fun to pass the time.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on October 28, 2015, 11:21:41 PM
Its now on ebay
I love this bit he puts near the end of the add

"So there we have it a lovely little car in lovely shape  which when completed will be a real rocket and worth a lot as they are getting rare!"

Err not worth a lot butchered with a bike engine in and not road legal !!


http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/G243VMT-/151864689666?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368

If you do a check on totalcarcheck.co.uk it says its been off the road since 2008 so this guy might not have ever driven it!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on October 29, 2015, 06:19:17 AM
There's an irony in that last statement..."getting rare"

There only getting rate as people keep chopping them up :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 13, 2016, 04:00:36 PM
It's been a while but ...........

http://www.ebay.co.uk/ulk/itm/272132944837

"Had for several years but need space comes with a firebird engine" (got bored/couldn't do it)
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on February 13, 2016, 04:35:57 PM
Seem to be a few failed bis models lately,  bis prices will be going up as more get chopped up.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 21, 2016, 02:33:38 PM
Annnnnd another :( "no engine as I was going to fit a bike engine". What a total waste! This particular car has been completely stripped down only for the owner to abandon all hope of finishing this hopeless project and is now for sale >:( what are the chances of it being put back on the road?  Bob Hope and no hope i'ld say....and Bobs gone home :(

https://www.ebay.co.uk/ulk/itm/301877755766
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on February 21, 2016, 02:39:03 PM
Thats a shame as i'd say that things got no hope of ever seeing the road again  :cry:

It says in the listing "The car was complete when purchased so everything here boxed up" but looking at the pictures the even looks doubtful. 
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on March 05, 2016, 07:08:17 PM
Here is actually a finished one for change on Gumtree.
http://tinyurl.com/gmngeoq

 I quite like it, but it`s all sort of wrong with it. It`s registered as a 1981 and it`s converted lhd ELX :-X
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on March 05, 2016, 07:14:14 PM
Hate it. But at least it's finished
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: dadandlad on March 05, 2016, 08:03:15 PM
Not a fan of it at all and no pictures of the engine installation, suspect on close inspection it is pretty rough
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on March 05, 2016, 08:38:36 PM
At least it's finished but how can it be road legal?

If you do a reg check it comes back as a 650cc but  says it has an R1 engine and they are 1000cc?
So has it not been declared it's had an engine change?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bambino126 on March 06, 2016, 12:32:51 AM
The reason that that one is finished is because he based his conversion on the aircooled car.

It's trying to do it on the BIS that always fails.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on March 06, 2016, 12:56:19 AM
Going by the pictures the engine is where the back seats should be as you can see a screen behind the front seats so don't think it makes much difference if it was an air cooled or bis.

Still don't see how its road legal if its still registered as a 650? 
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Pete126 on March 06, 2016, 02:57:30 AM
It's not road legal, still registered as a 650cc has no MOT and is on Sorn


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on March 06, 2016, 08:09:05 PM
Going by the pictures the engine is where the back seats should be as you can see a screen behind the front seats so don't think it makes much difference if it was an air cooled or bis.

Still don't see how its road legal if its still registered as a 650?


Ive read this again and some might see it as im being rude or offensive, im not and i probably never worded it very well but sometimes content on a forum can be taken many ways but if anyone read it and thought i was then sorry and certainly not my intention   :$
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on March 14, 2016, 09:27:32 PM
Another one  :)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/FIAT-126-PROJECT-1200cc-141BHP-BIKE-ENGINE-GEARBOX-MANIFOLD-26K-ANCILIARIES-READ/262333587864?_trksid=p2047675.c100011.m1850&_trkparms=aid%3D222007&algo=SIC.MBE&ao=1&asc=20140107083358&meid=748bbb75927e4150b71da569aee88b4a&pid=100011&rk=6&rkt=8&sd=231860445175
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on March 15, 2016, 06:13:53 AM
Weirdly this cars been doing the rounds on eBay for a while but not as a bike engined project but as a spares car hence why it's missing parts but I guess he's changed he mind at some point..... it's ashame as it could've been fantastic but people only seem to get a quarter of the way in before they give up.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on July 17, 2016, 12:12:28 AM
Another bike engined 126 thats still registered as a 700cc bis, comes with and mot and a v5 but how can it be road legal???

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/fiat-126-bike-powered-car-/322191380244?&_trksid=p2056016.m2516.l5255
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: stuey on July 17, 2016, 07:16:50 AM
its not- they've not notifed the DVLA of the engine change and the minute you do they will they probably force you to have a biva test which it might well fail and open you to a whole host of expense to get it road legal especially since it looks like they will have cut a hole in the floor to run the chain drive from that mid mounted engine- That said its about the best engineered most "finished" one I've seen in a while (not that the bar has been set high by some of the angle iron engineering I've seen on some) I'd still like to have a go with it though!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 17, 2016, 10:03:17 AM
Yes definatly the best one I've seen so far  :D still not a fan though as I could never get to grips with that wall behind the drivers seat which has to be in place if you go for that configuration also, no reverse? It's the compromise of having it that way around as oppose to using a different gearbox.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 17, 2016, 12:31:18 PM
comes with and mot and a v5 but how can it be road legal???


No, it says it "will" come with an MoT...  As for contruction and use regs, would that exhaust outlet ABOVE the rear bumper be accepted? I know the height range is defined for a motorcycle, but this isn't a motorcycle, and generally a car exhaust will exit belowthe rear bumper (so not sure what the regs are for deep water kits eg for Landys)

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 17, 2016, 07:12:09 PM
The exhaust height on some Hondas and more modern cars are within the bumper, some modern cars have cut outs so it may be acceptable, the mot tester should know.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on July 18, 2016, 12:04:23 AM
Its registered as a standard bis so what's the point? If you cant enjoy the car on a daily basis on the road then how can you enjoy the car for what it is?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 18, 2016, 12:31:43 AM
I suppose it all depends on what he cut out to get the chain drive in. I changed the engine in my 500 and only had to give the engine number and capacity, that's a straight engine swap, I believe it's the same if fitting say a scuby engine without cutting into the monocock.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 18, 2016, 12:33:23 PM
Its registered as a standard bis so what's the point? If you cant enjoy the car on a daily basis on the road then how can you enjoy the car for what it is?

Bearing in mind your post of 6 March about misinterpretation...   ;D and the fact that it seems we have the general question of "do you like this car?" crossing posts with "has the bodywork been cut away for the chain?", then my post now is: "

I don't understand what you mean by your post which says "what's the point?... ... ... enjoy the car for what it is".

Are you saying [A]: "one should enjoy a standard Bis for what it is, and if you don't like it then why did you buy it in the first place? If you wanted a dragster why didn't you buy one instead of trying to make a Bis into one?"

OR

Are you saying : "what's the point of notifying DVLA about the engine change, if they're happy to list it as a standard Bis then why bother telling them any different?" [the answer here in my view is that presumably not telling them means type approval (as opposed ot ordinary MoT) vehicle testing may have been by-passed, in which case insurance is probably invalid, which can become a seriously wealth-limiting option].

OR

Are you saying [C] something completely different and I've missed your point entirely.

[this begins to read like a script from Banzai... which-ah anfer does Fiat Fan mean, ayyy, or bee or seee, place-ah your bets! Banzai!!][any other Banzai fans on here?]  :P
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 18, 2016, 12:37:24 PM
Oops! my second answer option was labelled B within square brackets, which the software has interpreted as a Bold code, hence all the unintended heavy type. Sorry!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Xylaquin on July 18, 2016, 01:04:14 PM
I think he means what's the point in modifying a vehicle if you can't drive it on the road.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on July 18, 2016, 01:48:57 PM

Are you saying [A]: "one should enjoy a standard Bis for what it is, and if you don't like it then why did you buy it in the first place? If you wanted a dragster why didn't you buy one instead of trying to make a Bis into one?"

I think he means what's the point in modifying a vehicle if you can't drive it on the road.

Sorry for the confusion lol but Yes i mean i don't see the point if the car car never be road legal  :)

.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 18, 2016, 04:15:30 PM
Ah.. so the correct answer was [C], I'd completely missed the point !  :P

Well, I think the most frequent answer to that is, people get into these projects without thinking them through - which is the complaint Gadge has most often. Folks get all fired up thinking they'll make some fabulous customised special, without any real appreciation of the technical and "other" challenges they are taking on - those "other" challenges being all the paperwork and regulatory issues of type approval, registration, testing and so on. We see it all the time, don't we, even with a relatively straightforward project such as importing a LHD car.

That's not a criticism, by the way, I am as guilty as the next guy of rushing in to follow my dream fantasy, only to realise months later I've spent a shedload of dosh on something that will never fly. We all do it, and if we don't, if we're honest we like to *think* we might do it one day.

In addition to that group, there are people who just like to create weird and wonderful vehicles, regardless of whether or not they'll ever actually be used. You only have to look at the USA west coast rodding scene, you can barely walk for tripping over custom creations built solely for show in some promotion, or as a film prop, or as a simple ornament for those who have more money than taste (that's a personal judgment of course). One example that springs to mind is a fabulous custom chopper that was built purely as a tribute to the NYFD friremen who died in the 9/11 disaster. As I recall, it was intended only as a showpiece in a reception area, maybe in the HQ building? I don't know.

Then there's a third group who do very much intend to use the vehicle, but not on road - only for off-road competition. The obvious case here is the Blitz dune buggy style off-roaders, but think also Taz Racing. Some of their conversions are road legal, but I suspect that is pure coincidence rather than by design. And didn't we chat recently about something on eBay that was designed primarily to be a hill climb car?

So I think there *can* be a point to knowingly creating a vehicle that cannot be used on the road, but I suspect that Gadge has it right in thinking that *most* of the time, it's the first group that prevails - people who chase a dream and haven't thought it through.

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 18, 2016, 06:06:55 PM
Spot on :thumbup I haven't got any issues with bike engined cars it's just no one can see a project through. I'm all for modifying (my own car is testiment to that) it's just soooo annoying to see so many abandoned bike (or even car engined) projects tuning up and it's fustrating to see that people are still turning up with the usual questions.... :(

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on July 19, 2016, 08:24:35 AM
 Well here is something a bit different.
 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1977-S-REG-FIAT-126-RACE-CAR-ROAD-CAR-2-1-PINTO-ENGINE-/272312008039?hash=item3f670f7d67:g:5G4AAOSwIgNXjSZo
 MOT-ed, untaxed since 1992, registered as 1977 - 650cc and it looks like a post 95 EL shell :o.
 Must be good fun to drive though.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 19, 2016, 10:51:45 AM
I have actually seen this car at an autoitalia show earlier this year and I spoke to the chap who was very nice. It was built by someone who knows there onions when it comes to engine swaps and It's very well made and proves that with the right sort of engineering, engine swaps can be successfully done without comprimising the handling. You just have to think before you cut.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bambino126 on July 19, 2016, 05:12:07 PM
Oh yeah -  that's the car from Auto Italia that was parked next to mine this year.

Had a long chat with the guy. He went to great lengths to make a "front-engined" 126.

Big fella too - When he got in his 126 it was full up!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Pete126 on July 19, 2016, 05:26:15 PM
The problem is that it is still registered as a 650cc it may have an MOT and you could tax it as a 650cc but what do you insure it as, if you put 2.1 engine it does not match the DVLA records try and explain that to PC plod when you get stopped  or have an accident, if it had been through a SVA test it would have been registered as 2.1 engine it's basically a track car as all the other motor bike engined 126's are.


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bambino126 on July 19, 2016, 07:13:01 PM
So if he had registered it as 2.1, and then insured it as 2.1, would it then be road legal? Or is there more to it than that?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Pete126 on July 19, 2016, 07:53:12 PM
Its not as simple as that, because the bulk head has been cut extensively to fit the engine in which might compromise the rigidity of the body shell if it was not done correctly, it would have to go through the SVA test to make sure that it complied with SVA specification

Sent from my Timmy E86 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 19, 2016, 11:05:14 PM
So if he had registered it as 2.1, and then insured it as 2.1, would it then be road legal? Or is there more to it than that?

It's also a bit chicken and egg. If you tell the insurer you've swapped the engine and it's now (say) 2100cc, they say fine, here's the premium, you pay up, you're insured, right? Wrong. Because in signing the insurance application you are also declaring that the vehicle is roadworthy etc etc.

The catch 22 here is that unless you personally are a registered vehicle tester with your own test facility there's no way you can have tested the vehicle in compliance with the legal SVA test requirement. That means that, no matter how competent your engineering skills, in law the vehicle is NOT roadworthy. And *that* means that you have made a false declaration to the insurance company, and *that* means that you - in law - do not have any insurance, even though in fact you paid the premium.

So that in turn means you cannot legally drive to the SVA test station, you have to trailer the car there. Only when it's passed the SVA test can you be sure your insurance is valid.

Now of course all of these procedural hurdles can be overcome, but they are not trivial, nor are they free. Last time I got a car trailered it cost me over £300.  If you have deep pockets and lots of facilities at your disposal, loads of friends in the trade who have vans and welding kit and acres of free parking, typically in heated workshops, that's all well and good, and you can turn out pro quality cars like the blue one Ladislav spotted for 7 grand - but (having spent over that much myself on one car re-build project that was aborted due to spiralling costs) I expect that car cost more like sevenTEEN thousand to build, if it was costed commercially.

In the world of engineering, you can do pretty much anything you like, if you've got enough time and money. Sadly most of us haven't.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 20, 2016, 12:21:58 PM
This 126 was featured in January 2015 issue of Practical Performance Car. There is more detail on the build and builders. A note on the SVA test, this is maybe three-four years old, my friend bought a Porsche VW kit car which was part finished from America. He was running round in circles to get it through an SVA test. He contacted a kit car builder in England who said he could get it through, after a safety chech, as is as he was a low volume car builder. This was a cheaper option so the car went down south and returned a couple of days later. So there may be alternative routes for low volume car builders getting their cars road legal. Z Cars have built a few Fiat 500's with 2000cc+ Subaru engines and Subarugears reversed gear box's, which required modification to the rear floor pan and bulkhead these seem to be road legal as are their bike engined minis. Anyway this 126 was for sale in January 2015 for £10,000, if I were interested I would check out if it is legal for the road before parting with £7,000.


Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bambino126 on July 20, 2016, 01:15:44 PM
So as I understand it the SVA test should be the guys 1st port of call before registering, insuring or anything else - no point going any further if it doesn't pass or needs further work to pass.

He must be having trouble selling it, it was up for sale at £9000 at the show.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 20, 2016, 07:32:13 PM
Hi all just found this on line looks very interesting again what about SVA???  You need to scroll up for 500 kit

http://www.zcars.org.uk

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Da Londo on July 20, 2016, 07:55:03 PM
Hi all just found this on line looks very interesting again what about SVA???  You need to scroll up for 500 kit

http://www.zcars.org.uk

Ralph

Not bad at all!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 20, 2016, 10:21:33 PM
again what about SVA??? 

Ralph

As a low volume car builder I would imagine Z Cars (at least, the original firm - seems like they've had some changes to their business so maybe this is legally a new company) would have been authorised to self-certify its cars.

However, the chap in the video is talking about offering a DIY kit for customers who "want your Fiat 500 to go faster" (classic British understatement!) so if I as Joe Punter bought said kit and fitted it to my own Fiat bodyshell it would be no different legally from me getting an engine from a scrappy and building my own conversion from scratch - so I'd need to arrange my own SVA test. ... (and yes, Bambino126, the SVA test has to be the first hurdle as if you can't clear that then all else is money down the drain unless you have your own farmland or airstrip to drive around on)...

UNLESS:....

in the old days of kit cars, ie the 1960s and 1970s, before the onslaught of European-wide type approval regs etc, there were still requirements that any 'special' or conversion had to comply with what in those days was called Construction & Use Regulations, part of the Road Traffic Act iirc. Then as now, keen amateurs were long on enthusiasm but short on authorised test facilities.

To get around the C&U Regs requirements, kit car suppliers who offered a minimum number of the same model of kit could get a sort of type approval for their particular offering, provided it was built into a car by the buyer exactly as specified by the kit car manufacturer.

So for example, if KitKars4U had a production run of say 45 kits that they themselves had already had approved if used with a donor Ford Escort 1600, then provided the customer also used a Ford Escort 1600 donor, and provided he followed KitKars4U's assembly instructions to the letter, then the resulting vehicle was deemed to be approved, and would only be shown not to be 'correct' when it was tested at its first MoT test. If it passed, then all was fine and the use could enjoy it at leisure. (How and to what extent this arrangement was monitored and enforced I have no idea - most likely hardly at all... ah, the sixties...  8))

If on the other hand he decided to use the kit with a Chevy V36 2000cu in dragster donor, then he was back to square one and had to get the individual vehicle testing sorted out himself.

I don't know if this sort of approval is still available with kit cars today... anybody ?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 20, 2016, 11:55:52 PM
Just looked up type approval and guess what there is a system for multi stage builders. This allows for converting vehicles with a type approved alteration I copied a section see below:

Many vehicles are built using a process whereby a base vehicle (normally a chassis or chassis/cab) is produced and then another manufacturer (normally a body builder or converter) subsequently finishes the vehicle. To complement this real life situation a Multi Stage Approval process is available to enable the chassis manufacturer to approve the chassis (the first stage) as an "incomplete vehicle", when a body builder or converter approves the vehicle subsequently (a subsequent or final stage) it becomes a "completed vehicle".

This could be the method of keeping things legal as in days of old with kit car kits.

Only thing is I received a quote, two or three years back, from ZCars for an adapter plate, I was offered a kit which included the adapter plate, flywheel bolts and a starter for £2,000 or £4,000 fitted if I gave them a 500 without an engine.

Ralph
Title: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Pete126 on July 21, 2016, 01:43:35 AM
I think the key point is Chassis or Chassis Cab which I interpret relates to commercial vehicles I.e. You can buy say a ford transit chassis/cab which can become an ambulance, fire truck, tipper truck and so on, so all will be type approved as the basic chassis/cab has not been altered, cutting a monocoque chassis I would think is a different kettle of fish.


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Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on July 21, 2016, 02:32:31 PM
all will be type approved as the basic chassis/cab has not been altered, cutting a monocoque chassis I would think is a different kettle of fish.


Yes, you took the words out of my mouth. As each stage gets approved so the next stage can go ahead, provided nothing is done which negates the approval already given to an earlier stage.

So in your commercial vehicle example, a chassis will have specific mounting points for the bodywork it's intended for, and it will have a suspension spec'd to carry a specific range of weight in the body, etc. If the subsequent coachbuilder suddenly takes it upon himself to go away from those limits, then he will negate the earlier approval and have to start over again for the whole vehicle.

So if say the chassis was specc'd for an ambulance, body weight a few hundred kgs, but the coachbuilder then decided to fit a tipper truck body, capacity 30 tonnes, it's a fair bet the suspension (and hence the whole vehicle) would no longer be safe.

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 21, 2016, 05:10:44 PM
Guys, guys this is getting a bit deep and to a technical level in legislation that I am not knowledgable. The paragraph I highlighted was that a paragraph from a lot of technical documents which gave some avenue a small volume builder could use. After all you can re-body a car and you do not require an SVA test. Like the Cool 500, Simpatico and the Barcheta. Now to build a Barcheta you have to remove the 126 or 500 body and only use the floor pan, this has to be strengthened to stop it buckling. Therefore have you modified the monocock??? Anyway If I were to buy a kit to fit a 200bhp bike engine in the back of my car I would ensure all documents were in place prior to handing over any cash.  If you are in your own wee garage doing the same without the certs then you have to go through the SVA test. That is why I have opted to fit a Subaru engine mated to a 126 box in one of my cars, no modification to the car to get it to fit in.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on July 24, 2016, 09:48:47 AM
I have a Cool 500 which I believe was built by the kit manufacturer, well that's what I was told, anyway because of all this discussion I decided to check on how to register it if it turns out it hasn't. There is a massive amount of discussion on the net regarding registering kits cars, modified vehicles and hot rods and most of it contradicts itself. Now I found this leaflet of all places on a Volvo site?? The leaflet is a DVLA document which explains how to do it. Now ACE hava a letter from the DVLA or VOSA which states you do not need a receipt for an alternative body but the guide states you do, therefore as some of the sites suggest sometimes it all depends on the officer processing your application as the rules are so vague. See link below

http://www.volvoenthusiastsclub.co.uk/pdf/dvla%20vehicle%20approval.pdf

A rough rule of thumb hot Rodders use is you don't cut the chassis or monocoque as this would require an IVA, SVA or MSVA whichever is appropriate it' the other bits which have to be modified to fit the chassis or monocoque I.e. If you have a Suzuki SJ chassis and you wanted to fit an old say 126 body to it you would modify the body to fit the Suzuki chassis not the other way round.

Hope this helps

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on August 05, 2016, 09:45:30 PM
Hi all, just received an email to my enquiry to Z cars re bike engined conversion see reply below, still not sure how doing the cut and shunt to fit the engine at home complies ?? Might have to have the conversion done at Z cars.

Hi Ralph,

Apologies for the delayed response. I have been in Spain over the past few weeks looking for Fiat 500 and Minis to act as donor cars for our development fleet. I cannot provide all the answers at this time as we need to build and test our cars and ensure the kits are fit for purpose before we begin selling them. We will have a Hayabusa with a QBA drive and a Subaru engine. We are currently researching other Subaru engines as the engines are rare and then there is the issue of the gearbox having to be adapted as the engine is turned round requiring reverse gears to act as forward gears and a single forward gear acting as the revised reverse. I hope that makes sense!

The choice of either conversion from a kit only perspective is far cheaper than the Mini, but the rarity or exclusivity of both engines and as previously mentioned, the gear set kit required to flip the drive gears, means the hardware is pricey before you factor in labour.

On the SVA, we are looking at having the cars put through rigorous tests in one the EU regions, as we understand passing the registration regulations for limited run cars, lessens the burden of gaining the necessary certification in other EU member states, plus the admin can be reused to help satisfy obligations in further countries.

Prices can only be determined once we have our demo fleet completed. Apologies if this is disappointing news, but we must develop these kits responsibly.

Regards

David

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on August 06, 2016, 10:20:33 AM
 I wish I had enough money to take a 126 to Z Cars and just let them get on with it. I like that new bike engine set up they are planning for 500s.

 BTW as to DVLA and registration and all that. I had a fair share of my problems with them recently, as they only know black and white. Anything out of ordinary and you run into problems.
 I tried to re-register one of my 126 based kit cars recently. Unfortunately it doidn`t work out. After couple of months sending letters and documents back and forth they said the original 126 registration and VIN numbers are void. I got issued a new VIN number, was told it needs an IVA test and it will go on a Q plate. I`ll probably not go ahead with it because of the cost of the IVA test. The value of the kit car is not that great, so might just sell it as an off road buggy or something.
 I`ve got loads of other first hand experiences with DVLA, but it would be about couple of pages worth of writing.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on August 06, 2016, 02:59:50 PM
Hi, I am in the process of re-registering my 126 based kit, was your kit on a sorn ?

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on August 06, 2016, 03:08:47 PM
 I bought this kit car without a log book. Had the original number plates and when I looked the reg. up it still come up as a Fiat 126 De Ville. I had the original paperwork from back in the day including the bill of sale for the kit. This was all issued to the same guy who we bought the kit car from, so all would have been in his name, same as the 126 donor car. Unfortunately this didn`t make any difference.
 So when I tried to apply for a log book and DVLA realised it was a kit car, they just refused it. As I said the only way I could get it registered now would be IVA and a Q plate.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on August 07, 2016, 12:29:09 AM
I bought this kit car without a log book. ....
 So when I tried to apply for a log book and DVLA realised it was a kit car, they just refused it. As I said the only way I could get it registered now would be IVA and a Q plate.
This is a real shame Ladislav, as your previous contact with DVLA over the CC Zero I now have was very positive. If DVLA said the original registration was void, then presumably at some point a previous owner must have completed a Certificate of Destruction for it.

Can I ask, is the car in question your other CC Zero, or is it the MCA? And how much would the IVA test cost?
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on August 07, 2016, 08:12:03 AM
 Yes the car in question is a CCZero. The reg number still came up through car check sites as a Fiat 126, so I don`t think it was scraped.
 The reason why the said the original 126 reg number and vin is now void, because the CCZero has it`s unique chassis number and it didn`t tie up with what they had on the system for that 126 registration, which it of course wouldn`t.
 The kit was completed back in the day, but it was never properly registered and the owner passed away. 
 
 From what I understand the IVA test for mine would be £450 + £90 for re-inspection if it doesn`t pass the first time. I guess there is also the first registration fee of £55 on top plus the cost of trailering or recoovering the vehicle to the nearest IVA test centre.
 https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/individual-vehicle-approval-inspection-fees/individual-vehicle-approval-iva-inspection-fees-from-1-october-2014#iva-passenger-vehicles
 I would of course need to follow all the IVA guidelines to make sure my kit car complies.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on August 07, 2016, 08:33:30 AM
I agree a real shame, I have only seen one cc zero on the road this was many years ago. The car came from the Airdrie area just outside Glasgow, I tried to find it to see if it could be bought but no luck.  The locost, lotus 7 and  caterham builders have a wealth of information on passing the test and this subject of not being properly registered, it seems a few these cars sold on eBay were still registered as the downer vehicle. Best of luck with whichever way you decide to go.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 99flake on September 02, 2016, 07:42:48 PM
Not posted here for a long time, but was drawn to this post as I was interested in buying the 2.1 Pinto 126 after seeing it on eBay.
I've managed to find out it's still available,  but am still waiting on a reply regarding v5 / legality of it all.
Reading through this post has certainly been an eye opener though - I always knew changing an engine size could have its issues but didn't realise quite how much.
It will be interesting to see if I get an answer from the seller, but reading this post has been very helpful.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on September 03, 2016, 09:29:05 AM
Is it a blue one? If it is then I've actually seen it and it's very well made - nothing at all like the bodge it and ratchet bike engined stuff you usually see on eBay. It was built by a guy who I belive builds hot rods ( or race cars I can't remember exactly what he said) but it was LOUD when he started it up. It was an excellent conversion.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on September 03, 2016, 02:03:24 PM
Was this the blue 126 featured in Practical Perfomance CAR and on eBay, if it is I was also interested in it and I also asked the question on SVA etc. but I have had no reply as yet. There is no doubt regarding the quality of the build, the builder according to the feature was Charlie Emerick, who specialises in building Ford pop hot rods. The mag issue is No 129 January 2015 if you would like more information on the build.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 99flake on September 03, 2016, 02:49:06 PM
Yep, the blue one.
It did look like a quality build from the photos,  just a shame that at the moment there doesn't seem to be an answer regarding the legal side of things.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on September 03, 2016, 04:47:13 PM
If it's not road legal then it would need much ild say. Everything was or can be there regarding lights, seat belts etc it may need the emissions looking at as it was well rich when I heard it start up.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on December 27, 2016, 06:47:01 PM
Well it's been awhile and with 2016 almost over I thought I would just remind everyone that the cutting and chopping still continues ........ Here's one that's alittle different - not a bike engined project rather a BIS engined trike???? And not quite an unfinished project either (this ones very much finished!!  :o) but a waste nonetheless. £1500 the seller wants for this ridiculous looking machine that's been off the road since 2015 requiring "a little tinkering"........A new front end perhaps

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/361864023053
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 126blackbird on December 28, 2016, 05:57:14 PM
Oh come on Gadge you would look great driving this, it comes with air con as well.....................LOL
We all have different tastes, not mine but someone may like it. 
As you know I have a bike engined 126 and due to health reasons I'm not likely to finish it, but I have enjoyed building it. Some of the work was carried out by Z-cars and it's not a bodge job and I hope one day someone will take it on and finish it
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on December 28, 2016, 06:04:25 PM
Oh come on Gadge you would look great driving this.......

No I wouldn't ild look like an idiot .....and I don't need any help there  :P

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on December 28, 2016, 06:26:21 PM
I notice the vehicle is in Kilwinning. I don't suppose many of you know where that is, but as I once spent a couple of years living just down the road, it happens that I do. And it's one of the wettest places in the UK - as evidenced by the very damp conditions shown in the photos. So, to build a vehicle like this, which has no reasonable chance of offering any protection from the weather no matter how slowly one drives, shows I think something about the rather heroic aspirations of the builder. It may not be entirely surprising that although the vehicle is apparently complete, it doesn't seem to have had much use...  ;)
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on December 28, 2016, 11:18:02 PM
It reminds me of what used to happen to vw beetles back in the day, not my cup of tea either. It's just down the road from me and yes it is pretty wet in this neck of the woods, particularly this year as I've hardly had my Gamine out due to the amount of rain during this summer.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Xylaquin on December 29, 2016, 03:04:33 AM
I'm probably closest to it right now (I'm currently back in Renfrewshire on my Christmas visit).
Good luck to him getting that amount of money!  :P
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: mintex on January 03, 2017, 02:09:25 PM
Its for sale on a few of the bike groups on facbook too, its not my thing either, in my eyes it looks terrible lol. 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/222935171108991/permalink/1275594805843017/?sale_post_id=1275594805843017&pnref=story
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: drcdb15 on January 03, 2017, 06:56:49 PM
Interesting spot by one of the respondents on the Facebook listing: "Can i ask why you are really selling?? "Abused credit card so need to raise some funds" then PX or SWAPS "will gladly add cash for the right deal" ....  Oops!  :$
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on July 11, 2017, 07:25:37 AM
Not a bad effort from this seller. CBR1000 engine fitted and running in a BIS but needs tidying but the same old problems on fitting an upright engine in the back of the  IS means that the engine is in the car with you and of course can't use it on the road (yet) not sure about reverse and a compromise on the exhaust (due to space no doubt) means the back box is on the outside BUT no a bad effort but not enough to convince me it's good job.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on October 21, 2017, 06:26:57 AM
 Looks like it was meant to be after all. Apparently Fiat was experimenting with a Moto Guzzi engine in the back of the Fiat 500. It wasn't fitted at the end because they found it to be too powerful. Shame as it looks really neat.
 There is few on you tube with a similar set up.
 (http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/xq90/922/pAhdFR.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmpAhdFRj)
 (http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/xq90/922/egyLrl.jpg) (https://imageshack.com/i/pmegyLrlj)
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on October 21, 2017, 10:54:30 PM
Hi, where did you get that article? I would like to get a copy.

Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on October 24, 2017, 02:37:43 PM
 Ralph I found the information and the photos on the internet. Unfortunately I don't know wheat the original publication is.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: 1973/126 on June 21, 2018, 10:59:12 AM
 As we haven't had one for long time ;D.
https://tinyurl.com/y7ufvjyc
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Xylaquin on June 22, 2018, 12:08:56 AM
and it's a RHD aircooled as well  :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on June 22, 2018, 07:17:34 AM
This is the part that of it’s life where the owner gets bored and they just get passed around on eBay.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on September 22, 2018, 09:22:20 PM
Here’s another one

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F302893821173

Chopped up in 2004 when the car would’ve only been about 14 years old it’s never been finished and still needs its front suspension finishing. The configuration of this conversation means that the engine sits so far forward that there’s no passenger seat so totally unusable. Despite all that the owner wants somewhere in the region of £4500 but is willing to break the car up so maybe he also thinks after 14 years the project is fruitless....... will the butchery ever end!  :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on September 23, 2018, 07:38:53 PM
Gadge, I agree butchered, this will never see the road in my opinion to much needed to pass SVA or BIVA inspection, so much structure to put back.
Ralph
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Xylaquin on October 04, 2018, 11:49:22 PM
another one for the hall of fame!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/253915977823
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on December 19, 2018, 06:35:57 AM
And another although not a bike conversion but just as bad. Bought because the owner saw a few YouTube clips of Punto engined 126s and thought it’ll be a good laugh this 12,000 (!) mile BIS has had its engine removed and then just sat in storage while until the interest dwindled now there is a loss of storage so it’s listed as a dreaded “spares or repairs” vehicle :(

There is a small glimmer of hope for this car though as it does come with its original engine but it’ll need rebuilding and refitting. It’s fate now rests in the highest bidder :(

https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.co.uk%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F123552185080
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 06, 2019, 08:11:53 PM
Aaaaaannnndddd one more  :cry: This one is a prize example of why I dispare at bike engined projects.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/223370089357

This one which is a BIS (of course! they are the cheapest and most unsuitable versions to try and squeeze a bike engine into after all!) was by all accounts a sound enough car before its fate was sealed by two people - one a car restorer and one and engineer. If anyone could muster the courage to pull off the seemingly impossible task of completing a successful bike engined 126 you would think an engineer and a car restorer could get it done but sadly not. A start was made by admittedly doing the right thing and upgrading the antiquated leaf Spring/drum brakes with something more suitable for a high powered bike engine - a wise and often overlooked thing to do but then  "Life got in the way"  (they lost thier storage, realised it was a bigger job than originally thought and got bored of the idea) so now this half baked once salvageable car is now gutted, modified partly and now up for sale  :(

There is at time of rant 1 bidder but it might as well be scrapped - will the madness ever stop!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bar Vitelli on February 07, 2019, 07:18:46 AM
All of that said, it does look like it would at least make a good BBQ grill or half car trailer...
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 07, 2019, 07:42:06 AM
All of that said, it does look like it would at least make a good BBQ grill or half car trailer...

Oooh a BBQ grill! There's an idea!  :P
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bar Vitelli on February 07, 2019, 05:56:27 PM
Oh dear, don’t look on eBay, Gadge,there is another one that’s just been listed although at least this one has had a new rear spoiler added...
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 07, 2019, 07:17:42 PM
OH JESUS!!!  :o

Ok so as Bar Vitelli has just eluded to here's another one..... 1 day after the last and pretty much the same scenario "was gonna put a bike engine in but never got round to it" AHHHHH ##*%%#**  :-

What cracks me up is that they've spent time fitting a bucket seat and a spoiler but not even attempted the engine bit!! How on earth can people just simply get bored!!!
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bar Vitelli on February 08, 2019, 08:12:19 PM
Deep down, you’ve got to respect people for trying or at least dreaming with these projects, I must admit it would be nice to have some extra oomph sometimes with our little cars, I once did 76 mph downhill in my green car and it was amazing and I can understand why people give it a go with the conversions, truth is, they are very small cars and Fiat was years ahead of its time in what they were able to achieve in such a small space, improving on that is always going to be difficult.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on February 08, 2019, 10:21:39 PM
Not really feeling the respect thing. It's not the conversion that bites me - engine conversions are a natural thing to car enthusiasts - I've seen the YouTube clips from Poland with successful bike engined cars and they're fantastic but over here in Blighty we don't seem to possess the same skill. We have the dream but no foresight to carry the project through. This thread alone is full of "projects" where people want to fit the most obscene engines in these cars yet seemingly can't seem to finish the job and the cars they're chopping up are reasonably good cars! Bought for beer moneny then discarded when the realisation sinks in that it can't be done  :( and the most fustrating thing is that nearly all of them seem to end in the same way, the owner strips the car starts to do a bit of work then ........nothing! It ends up on eBay!  ???

There is an obsession with fitting high powered engines in 126s and I'll never get why. They could choose an old mini or a cinquecento yet it's the 126 they want. A FIRE engine 126 using an aircooled shell is the ideal engine conversion and one i'ld love to do myself but nooooooo its got to be a bike engine with its complex gearbox set up and unrealistic mounting position "how hard can it be!" they say yet they never finish them off. I wonder where all of the 9 pages worth of posts of still born bike engine projects are right now? Sitting in a yard by some wannabe engineer wondering how to fit an engine with chain drive and no reverse gear into a car that was designed to use an engine mounted in the rear? My campaign to highlight this travesty will continue until this madness stops!  :P
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Bar Vitelli on February 09, 2019, 08:06:16 AM
Trikes are the thing that hurt the most, I’ve nothing against them as such but when I see some of the cars that were chopped up to make them it breaks my 126 heart.  :(
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Xylaquin on February 09, 2019, 09:11:40 AM
There is an obsession with fitting high powered engines in 126s and I'll never get why. They could choose an old mini or a cinquecento yet it's the 126 they want.

This. I think it's simply the looks and uniqueness. Everyone's seen a classic mini, not everyone's seen a 126.

I'm no longer bothered by failed conversions, and have taken to the opinion that it makes the remaining unmolested cars more valuable.
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: thepuddlejumper on February 14, 2019, 12:33:57 AM
The thing is in Poland you don’t have to pass SVA or BIVA or what ever our masters decide we need to do to keep the vehicle on the road. Therefore, it is much easier to do what you want provided it’s safe. On more modern cars you can’t install larger engines as you have to keep the emissions as per the original vehicle. Big Brother
Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Amateb8 on June 14, 2019, 07:45:17 PM
.......and yet another 126 Bis bite the dust. Another unfinished bike engine project.

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-126-bike-engine-project-car/264359631932?hash=item3d8d0fdc3c:g:2C8AAOSwul9dATFH

Title: Re: Another bike engined project bites the dust :(
Post by: Gadge on June 15, 2019, 09:33:32 AM
.......and yet another 126 Bis bite the dust. Another unfinished bike engine project.

 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fiat-126-bike-engine-project-car/264359631932?hash=item3d8d0fdc3c:g:2C8AAOSwul9dATFH

Yes this "project" is the same car that was featured on eBay 4 months ago (see above posts) and seems staring at the box of bits and realising the work involved came to the same conclusion...... He got bored :( so yet again it's up for sale. theres definitely a pattern occurring with this car