Club126UK

Fiat 126 Chat => Tuning & Customising 126 Models => Topic started by: bis13 on January 24, 2009, 12:59:39 PM

Title: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 24, 2009, 12:59:39 PM
well i had to get started at somepoint only thing is now it wont stop raining ! all i have done is stripped out my shell ready for some alterations. i will endevour to post my progress so that it may be of help for future projects (or not lol).  cut out old venting not needed in the engine compartment which will give more room .
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: hudsonhenry on January 24, 2009, 05:47:41 PM
About bl**dy time......

Strangely I've just spent the day doing the same thing, the 500's now almost down to a bare rolling shell, race you......

I'm not sure I'm the looms going back in now its been ripped out, anybody out there good with electrics????

I'm looking forward to regular 'project 1108' updates. Give me a call if I can help in any way.

Nigel
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 25, 2009, 05:03:05 PM
cheers nige as for the loom i took it out nice and gently and its now nestled up all snug and warm in the glove box!!! i am rewiring completely different lights and indicators in so i might still have to replace a good chunk of it! by the way i like your sump its looking very "gucci"!! ive been looking at guy crofts site and its making very interesting reading!hopefully i can start shutting up all the redundant holes in the car this week when it stops raining if not i shall be busy with the gearbox refurb.


Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: 126dave on January 26, 2009, 03:54:46 PM
im lookin forward to seeing this take shape....... [-/
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on January 26, 2009, 04:00:05 PM
im lookin forward to seeing this take shape....... [-/

Ditto, I've had a 1242 upgrade for the Sei on the cards for a while (just finding the time and funds) which will give me an 1108 with less than 30k on the clock to use. Keep us informed Mick :)
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 28, 2009, 07:44:24 PM
rain is a pain in the bum..got me zintec now to start filling holes up . one gearbox is now done just got to replace the bits i took off to paint then start on the bis box which is going in first after ive swapped the bellhousings .
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: stuey on January 28, 2009, 08:20:07 PM
stupid question do you have to mod the 126 gearbox to accept a 1108?.. ie will it take the extra power?
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Tomasz on January 29, 2009, 12:06:56 AM
ooh exciting, im looking forward to following the progress.
I still have an aircooled (other than my green one) waiting for some progress.  Only problem is just about every panel is rotten.  Good job i just learnt to weld!
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 29, 2009, 12:47:18 AM
no mods just an adapter plate to fit to engine but nothing done to the gearbox internals .
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: stuey on January 29, 2009, 08:02:27 AM
sorry more questions.. will it fit in a bis, whats the engine from and what sort of bhp is it likely to put out (Im getting more and more off the idea of a bike engine for mine...)
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 29, 2009, 08:57:10 AM
youd need an aircooled bellhousing to do it as it is here and you will have to cut the back up to get the engine in and it will be bloody noisy if you did it, if you put a bike engine in then you have to think lots about how your going to get the power to the wheels there was a car on ebay recently with a chain drive only problem is you drive that round corners and see what happens!! as for power its a standard cinq/sei sporting 1108 engine with a bigger carb so i will see when its in and goes to be set up properly on a rolling road.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on January 29, 2009, 09:00:29 AM
as for power its a standard cinq/sei sporting 1108 engine with a bigger carb so i will see when its in and goes to be set up properly on a rolling road.

Now that's an interesting one, afaik the 1108 has a throttle body with fuel injection rather than a carb (certainly the one in my Sei does). As far as power Stuey, they produce about 54bhp standard.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Paulh81 on January 29, 2009, 12:33:45 PM
yeah, but shove it in a car that weighs peanuts, and as few mods here and there i think mick shud get 75bhp? perhaps.. now thats a quick little car
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on January 29, 2009, 12:46:38 PM
now thats a quick and dangerous little car, plus put on that exhaust of yours and make some ears bleed  **-
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 29, 2009, 04:56:54 PM
today i started cutting the shell up a little before putting new metal in.
tommorow i shall put the wheels back on and put it in the garage and i chop more off lol..
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: nrg19uk on January 29, 2009, 05:06:37 PM
nice postage stamps mick, can with have some bigger pictures heheheh
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: dajwid on January 29, 2009, 05:42:54 PM
Click on the pic, it grows ;)
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on January 29, 2009, 05:54:22 PM
just curious, why did you cut off that part which holds the headlights?
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: 126dave on January 29, 2009, 05:59:06 PM
just curious, why did you cut off that part which holds the headlights?

hehehehehehehehhee
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 30, 2009, 12:00:05 AM
all will be revealed lol
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on January 30, 2009, 12:53:22 AM
 :- I HAVE GOT TO KNOW!!  :D :D lol. just hurry up with the revealing...  [-/
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 30, 2009, 02:30:40 PM
the car lost a bit more weight today , the screen is just an idea as it might be too restrictive i must check the law first.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: hudsonhenry on January 30, 2009, 03:06:15 PM
You gotta do it speedster style, just a removable aero screen and a cover where the rear seats were.

Inspiration:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MG-A-Speedster_W0QQitemZ160311509283
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on January 30, 2009, 03:14:04 PM
not sure if this is true, but ive been told that the 126 roof is what holds the car together.. have you done anything to re-inforce the shell? it might just snap down the middle  :oops:

and what hudsonhenry said  :D [-/
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on January 30, 2009, 03:41:04 PM
well its having the back screened over but i will leave two up front , i have an option to do a seperate windsheild i was just playing around to see what it would look like as i wish to keep the square blocky lines of the 126 and the front pillars are very thick and i can insert a good sized piece to strengthen the whole structure. as for the worry about my car folding up i am inserting tubing on the interior to brace the body and aid the rear roll bar ,underneath i am beefing it up also. i hope to avoid
any sort of flexing by doing this as the body is no longer rigid where i have removed the roof.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Pete126 on February 04, 2009, 08:36:32 PM
I thought you may be going for the gangster l00k 8)

(http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m152/pedro126/hjhjjcopy2_edited-1copy.jpg)
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: nrg19uk on February 04, 2009, 09:29:12 PM
I thought you may be going for the gangster l00k 8)

(http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m152/pedro126/hjhjjcopy2_edited-1copy.jpg)


hahahaha squash the roof down more :-P
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on February 09, 2009, 03:19:58 PM
ive been down to the local vosa testing centre today to chat about new regs that will come in with the new iva and have a multitude of things to plan in order to get it passed off , the only real issues that they are more concerned about are seatbelt anchor point heights and brake testing so i might have to consider really beefing up the brakes with discs front and rear , i am in contact with a kitcar builder as i must keep within the guidelines set by vosa and use materials regulary used by kitcar producers . and its raining ..
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Rusty's Uncle on February 09, 2009, 04:18:28 PM
Hi Mick , what is the issue with the kit car people & regular materials ? Just interested as I have been thinking about putting together a front disc brake set from scratch which seems do able for under £100 if the adaptor plates can be made or got for a reasonable price.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Darrell on February 09, 2009, 05:21:23 PM
Is there anything special about the adaptor plates or are they just a shaped piece of plate with holes drilled in them?

Because I know of a little engineering company who would do them for a good price.

Could probably just get some plate and make them myself!
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on February 09, 2009, 06:36:59 PM
its not a problem if you are rigging up disc brakes for your car however if its got to be sva or biva tested they do a four stage brake test if you do it for your car it will only have to meet mot standards. as for the plates for the discs you can use what you want as long as its man enough. i have got to find out the age of my engine as if its newer than 1992 i will have to fit injection and a cat doh!
 
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Rusty's Uncle on February 11, 2009, 05:47:51 PM
As there are so many 126s & 500s running around now with disc brakes it is surprising that there is not more info on the net about the conversion with regards to suitable parts and adaptor plate drawings. I can't seem to find the link that someone posted to the Polish web site that did have a drawing of a plate. Anyway if your cat needs injection get some pet insurance quick  ;D
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: goombas on February 11, 2009, 06:59:41 PM
questions about the f.i.r.e. + 126 gearbox
 who will be able to take the 1st gear noise (larger torque of 1.1)
 is fitting f.i.r.e. gb into 126 very difficult?
and my advise fit 1.2 head on the 1.1 with custom cai, n-group exhaust, computer mods you can acheive about 80 bhp it could be a killer bug :D
my friend had a cc made like that in LPM TUNING in Poznań. it had 84 bhp
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: nathan126 on February 11, 2009, 10:18:47 PM
With that power im sure you could pull away in 2nd?  [-/
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on February 12, 2009, 07:24:41 AM
I often pull away in 2nd with the Sei ...  :oops:
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Tomasz on February 13, 2009, 01:00:32 AM
im still think about doing this conversion at some point, i have a spare aircooled that would be suitable.  You can get the bits you need from trs.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on February 13, 2009, 12:01:58 PM
well it looks like i am well and truly buggered .. i am going to have to cease my little project due to the fact i will not have the facilities to do the work on the car as i cannot find another garage . i shall be selling all the bits i have (engine ,bits plus bis gearbox, plus exhaust ) i paid 450 for the lot so if anyone wants it they can have it and the gearbox comes free! lol.
i am sorry that i cant continue as my circumstances have changed rapidly and have been forced into this decision , i have the base shell of my "126 roadster" that i shall either sell "as is" if any offers or i will break it up and strip the usefull parts off like hubs suspension steering etc. please contact me if any one is interested via pm . thankyou . mick
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on February 13, 2009, 12:57:15 PM
Damn, I hope the change of circumstances isn't anything too serious.

Was looking forward to seeing how this progressed too :(
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: 1973/126 on February 13, 2009, 02:08:50 PM
 I thought Mick was too quiet. What a shame. If I had the space for it, would take it on(same old thing)
 Anyway hope you are O.K., and get everything sorted, and someone will save your roadster as well.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: hudsonhenry on February 14, 2009, 09:30:44 AM
Noooooo

You gotta find a way! Can't you just store the engine and so on for a bit until you find somewhere to work on it? fitting it into an otherwise standard shell would only take a week or two.

Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on February 14, 2009, 10:06:54 AM
well i will see what i can do if nothing else.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: 126dave on February 15, 2009, 01:58:20 PM
Mick.............damn shame...........there must be way out ?  :(....can store/convert at my place but its abit far mon amie
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Darrell on February 15, 2009, 08:20:57 PM
Bugger! :(
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Tomasz on February 15, 2009, 09:05:18 PM
oh no!  i was looking forward to seeing it completed.  I would buy the kit but i am in brighton at the mo in a flat and i have no money! if only it were later in the year when when i was back in norfolk and working!
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on February 17, 2009, 02:13:05 PM
Sorry to hear that Mick...  :( But im sure youll start another 126 project soon enough.
Hope youre OK though, Gordan  [-/
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Dom on March 03, 2009, 12:54:39 PM
This may come as an extra blow on top of your current troubles regarding the modded 126.

Quote from Pistonheads. (http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=140&t=655749&mid=97587&nmt=Panic%20attack:%20SVA%20and%20the%20IVA)

"The SVA will be replaced by the BIVA / IVA in April of this year.

The actual rules re car building will not change a great deal - the cost of the test will - a figure in excess of £500 has been suggested but not, as far as I know, confirmed.

It has also been reported that the new BIVA / IVA system will be much more rigorously enforced than the present SVA in the sense that those who build or modify cars without getting the V5 details updated or the car tested (where appropriate), will be hit hard by the authorities. It is also rumoured that eventually cars presented for an MOT which are obviously new builds or highly modified will have to be referred to VOSA by the MOT tester if the computer records do not show that the car has been through the IVA / BIVA procedure.

The message is build it right and get it registered properly.

Full details of the new system can be found here:

http://www.transportoffice.gov.uk/crt/vehicledeale..."
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Gordan on March 03, 2009, 03:33:51 PM
The way this is going it will be easier/cheaper to register the car on Barbados, trinidad&tobago or some place similar  :o
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on March 04, 2009, 09:41:20 AM
ive already been down to the local vosa centre and have had a good chat about what i intend to do and have now got a personal advisor if i need to consult him ! they are very helpfull to be honest . the only major factors to be considered are if you change the seat belt geometry it must meet requirements where a strange format is used to work it all out , and there is a four part braking test this is where most cars fail . i have no dosh to do anything at the moment but hopefully i will be in employment again soon so then can continue with my project.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: fightingtorque on March 14, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
questions about the f.i.r.e. + 126 gearbox
 who will be able to take the 1st gear noise (larger torque of 1.1)

From experience of running single cylinder utility engines on our dyno........  I think a 4 cylinder 1100 motor might not be so much harder on the transmission than a 2 cylinder 700cc.  There is more total torque delivered by the 4 cylinder but the cyclic peak stresses might not be higher because the power is made across 4 firing events instead of 2.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on March 16, 2009, 09:20:33 AM
thats a positive point you have in favour of our much maligned gearbox the only problem i can find is the weakness in the transfer of power to the wheels, but there is a driveshaft replacement kit using tripods and halfshaft that are available which then take away the need to use those stupid silent blocks.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on June 10, 2009, 12:40:58 PM
Any further progress on this mick? I seem to remember seeing that you were getting started again but could have been mistaken.

I've sourced a 1242 engine and gearbox for the Seicento so will hopefully be starting this project myself fairly soon, though I guess I ought to sort the brakes and suspension on the Sei to accomodate the extra powerrrrr :D

Just a thought but how much work would be involved (bearing in mind I've never dismantled a gearbox) in using the box from the Sei, or at least the gears themselves in the orig 126 box? Part of the reason I want to do this is to make a more stable long distance cruiser so would like a 5th gear if possible.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on June 10, 2009, 07:30:23 PM
 your asking if you can fit the sei inards into a 126 box? i cant imagine they are similar so my guess would be no but if you posed this question to a gearbox expert then it may be a different answer!
as for the project i havent yet restarted as i must get my house in order first but it will be restarted soon as i can do all the body welding in the summer.   
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: hudsonhenry on June 12, 2009, 03:47:31 PM
Any further progress on this mick? I seem to remember seeing that you were getting started again but could have been mistaken.

I've sourced a 1242 engine and gearbox for the Seicento so will hopefully be starting this project myself fairly soon, though I guess I ought to sort the brakes and suspension on the Sei to accomodate the extra powerrrrr :D

Just a thought but how much work would be involved (bearing in mind I've never dismantled a gearbox) in using the box from the Sei, or at least the gears themselves in the orig 126 box? Part of the reason I want to do this is to make a more stable long distance cruiser so would like a 5th gear if possible.

Anything is possible at a price.... Have a look here:

http://www.scuderiatopolino.com

They sell a 600 transaxle which has had the gearbox side cut off and the gearbox from a modern five or six speed fiat welded on. It looks very heath robinson and is some feat of engineering!

You can get srtonget internals for the standard box from Bacci in Italy and its worth looking into having all the components cryogenicly treated to add strength:

http://www.frozensolid.co.uk/

But non of this would be cheap, better to get rolling before puttig your foot down, most damage will be done by drag racing starts from a stand still.

Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Eklipze3k on June 15, 2009, 03:21:51 PM
Not a fan of drag racing tbh so not going to be partaking I don't think ;)

Something that was raised on ClubCento when I was asking questions about 3rd party ECU's for ignition, etc:

"the oil pickup sits down near the bottom of the sump, turning the engine that way round, as you accelerate all the oil will travel along the whole length of the sump and move away from the pickup, starving the engine of oil, and same when you brake"

Is this a concern and how do we get around it?
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: dajwid on June 15, 2009, 09:28:15 PM
Ridges on the bottom of the sump. I think the Alloy ones have ridges to stop this problem ???
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on June 15, 2009, 10:14:32 PM
if you have problems you need a baffled sump , check out hudson henrys modified 500 website and all will be revealed.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: Jan-in-UK on June 24, 2009, 10:29:30 PM
How is the project going? If going? Did you sort your house yet?
 8) hope you are well, I am a fan of swaps and strong engines in our small cans. Would like to see yours progressing.
Keep us posted mate. All the best.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: bis13 on June 25, 2009, 08:48:08 PM
i am getting it sorted out slowly..thanks.
Title: Re: project 1108
Post by: fightingtorque on July 02, 2009, 10:40:55 PM
Not a fan of drag racing tbh so not going to be partaking I don't think ;)

Something that was raised on ClubCento when I was asking questions about 3rd party ECU's for ignition, etc:

"the oil pickup sits down near the bottom of the sump, turning the engine that way round, as you accelerate all the oil will travel along the whole length of the sump and move away from the pickup, starving the engine of oil, and same when you brake"

Is this a concern and how do we get around it?

Person who said that presumably never turns corners in his car?

There is a fair logic but cornering forces tend to be higher, I have had more problems with transverse engines in cornering than inlines in accel/braking.  But as said, if it turns out to be a problem (watch the oil pressure/ oil light) you can baffle it.